Against the Ogre Horde 2024 Remake Edition Suggestions

[Kurgan]

There may be people out there who hope HeroQuest moves to a more exclusive realm. I simply respectfully disagree with those fans. I would rather more people are able to get their hands on these expansions, not just a smaller group in only a few countries.

I see Miniature Market is now showing "out of stock." Has anyone else gotten their order cancelled and/or refunded yet? I'm not saying you should cancel, I'm asking if they did this automatically like they did for GeekGoneGiddy?

Thanks for keeping the news flowing guys... don't shoot the messenger. I'd like to know what's going on, good or bad. Hasbro is in a position to clarify this easily enough and also hear our complaints and give Avalon Hill permission to address it publicly. I hope they do soon...

[Kurgan]

Avalon Hill has posted this (and many people sent it to me) not to worry, that the expansion is not Cancelled. I was bewildered by this at first because I thought the issue was people were concerned about it being a limited or pulse exclusive release (temporarily or permanently). Then one of my moderators, a friend, seekhashem called me out... in my own angry knee jerk reaction on AH discord, I posted a list of possible implications of the Miniature Market post (the one where they claimed they were told ATOH wasn't coming to retail stores) and the last one was "or it is cancelled completely." I should have nuanced that last statement, because I really didn't (even at the time) think it was very likely at all that it would be CANCELLED. So my bad, my fault, sorry for fueling a false rumor. I'm embarrassed I let that comment go for so long (I've now corrected it). I probably contributed to someone's headache over at their social media group, and I'm sorry about that too.

But is it time to relax? Because I was wrong about that point, there's nothing to "worry" about when it comes to HeroQuest? Not quite...

Rant Begins (skip if you don't like reading...):
Now people are saying that their own pre-orders of ATOH from other sites have NOT been cancelled. I've been informed that Miniature Market was a "big" retailer, so the implications of it cancelling & refunding orders and giving this kind of feedback had big implications. Perhaps the agent who posted the message to GeekGoneGiddy was misinformed or misspoke? Time has gone by and we haven't seen a domino effect with other stores, so that to me is a better sign.

We've learned that "never" isn't always "never" in the world of HeroQuest. Many items from the Mythic tier that so many were sure would "never" come to retail now have, and actual rumors say more is to come. But my real worry was that HeroQuest would be moving to an exclusive model... that we'd see items only available on Pulse, long or short term. In the past we've been given mixed signals on this from Hasbro.

On the one hand they had AH apologize for the Guardian Knights being a limited release. They didn't realize so many fans wanted original content or that there was such a high demand. Once that supply ran out, that was it. Eventually AH had their chance to redeem that situation by having a new sculpt of the character available inside the (retail) Rise of the Dread Moon box. That was great!

Then they gave Premium members an hour (?) to pre-order SQT/PoT before anyone else. As far as exclusives go that wasn't such a big deal. It wasn't the same as saying ONLY premium members could get it. It wasn't a limited time or limited stock release, so it wasn't going to stop everyone else from getting it. I remember it being rumored that for two months it would be a pulse exclusive (from Nov 15th, presumably), but Amazon.com started selling it officially on Dec 8th, so that turned out to be false. Despite the "Pre-order" sign still being up on the Pulse page, people were getting their packs early.

I'm not saying as fans we deserve to have everything early, but I am against the idea that they will try to force their customers to buy it direct from their website. As convenient as that might be, Pulse has a tendency to not lower their prices (this isn't always true, more recently we've seen they added an "outlet" page that has discounted items, mostly action figures). For instance the main HeroQuest products all were put up there and the prices actually INCREASED. AH members stated publicly on discord that they were happy people were buying their products. As long as they were bought new, Hasbro was making money, and there was no significant difference between buying from some other online retailer vs. Pulse directly. The company was not losing money for this (some fans were concerned that somehow they were and asked if they needed to buy direct to support the franchise... now that's loyalty!). Many of us speculated that while that's the case they might make slightly more if they sell direct.

That said, it's my understanding that Pulse is not available to ship to all countries. That's why there are stores like Zavvi, or regional versions of Amazon and stores that are specific to other countries outside Europe and North America. Unless or until Hasbro specifically starts shipping to those other countries, many (potentially a great many) fans are shut out of buying a product. This could encourage scalpers to buy up quantities of the US/English version and sell them to other places. Many good-hearted fans (like the folks right here) would be happy to do this at cost, but some others are not so generous and would give significant markup. Of course unlike a limited run product, they can't get away with charging so much as more people get wise to what's going on.

My other fear is that while we have a predicted year of HQ releases (ATOH, Jungles of Delthrak, the Dread Dice, and... rumored dreams of Crypt of Perpetual Darkness retail or a bonus box of some kind perhaps that turns out to be this "other IP" themed release mentioned on social media), maybe that's all we get. Maybe they'll scale back the releases. Worst case scenario we get some limited releases... maybe they ship out the stock and that's it for that one. But they already know what happens when they do that (see the backlash over the Guardian Knights, or even the many who still complain about the Mythic release). Hopefully all they really intend to do is make these short term Pulse exclusives. But even that to me is a step backwards. The idea would be to get more people into HeroQuest, not less.

To me being respected as a fan isn't to give me special perks for being in an exclusive club, it's to show me that you care about a wide community of customers by giving them equal (as much as you can) access to products. We understand not every single language group is going to get their own localized version. Not every person is going to be able to realistically afford a $99 game with $15-$40 expansions (as prices drop that's basically what it is on other sites) to enjoy with their family. But putting stuff behind a membership wall or limiting it to english speakers in one or two regions isn't the way. HeroQuest was created and is remembered as a game with "global" reach, for a wide range of ages (not just kids under 12, not just adult collectors).

Why can't we just have fun and not "worry" (compared to things that directly affect our lives and create real stress, like job, family, economy, etc)? Games are for fun! It's because Avalon Hill (whom I don't blame for any of this, they simply have to obey what is given to them from their Hasbro bosses, the AH people really seem to be fans and care for the most part) has such a great track record so far with us. If we hadn't had the layoffs and the Miniature Market email with its discouraging implications... I don't think I'd be posting any of this. The fear that all this good will could be undone so quickly and easily is always looming in the background. It'd be a shame, so I think we should all keep alert. I'd rather be wrong about something like this, having said my peace, than just ignore my chance to do something about it. Fans will vote with their wallets. And yeah, we miss Chris & Bill. They'd have quashed these rumors right away. I remember many conversations where things were patiently explained to fans, in a respectful way. After all, who of us works in the industry or knows how things go at Hasbro? Short of opening up their marketing portfolio and reading through their company policies, that did a lot to clear up confusion. I miss that access we all had. Hopefully we get that again. Consistency in keeping their public informed is something they need to work on.
/Rant Over

So what is this "exciting announcement" for the end (29th?) of February? Surely it will be announcement that pre-orders are live (ATOH is supposed to be a March release), but what else might they say? Here's hoping it's a list schedule of the years releases, and a re-assurance that nothing else is cancelled, put behind membership paywalls, etc.

[Again just a reminder, I posted an apology video over my knee-jerk comments reacting to the MiniatureMarket message. I see how people could have taken my comments (in the AH discord especially) to be saying I somehow knew or thought ATOH would likely be cancelled. That wasn't what I thought but I wrote what I wrote and it upset some people. Thanks goodness I was wrong! ]

[Kurgan]

Thanks Virg for (re) posting this: https://www.pixiegames.fr/catalogue/1605-heroquest-ext-contre-la-horde-des-ogres-5010996260789.html

HEROQUEST - EXT. CONTRE LA HORDE DES OGRES

à paraître...

De mystérieuses forces occultes interfèrent avec la magie de Mentor ! Pack de quêtes pour votre aventure HeroQuest !
Détail
Nombre de joueur 2 à 5 joueurs
Age 14 ans et +
Durée d'une partie 90 min

Editeur : Hasbro
Auteur : Stephen Baker
Illustrateur : Max Dunbar

PVC : 59,90 €

EAN : 5010996260789

Référence : à venir
A Propos...

L’action est au rendez-vous dans cette extension HeroQuest ! Les héros se lancent dans un voyage périlleux dans une société peuplée d’ogres pour empêcher Zargon de corrompre leur peuple. Avec 7 quêtes classiques modernisées, 3 quêtes entièrement originales, des figurines exclusives et une nouvelle manière de jouer en tournois.

Contenu :

Livre contenant 10 quêtes
28 figurines Premium
28 cartes
Feuille de jeu
Feuille de jeu (arène)

Machine translation from French to English:

Mysterious occult forces are interfering with Mentor's magic! Quest pack for your HeroQuest adventure!
Detail:
Number of players 2 to 5 players.
Age 14+.
Duration of a game 90 min

A partial translation from SteveRS2000 on HeroQuestFans discord:

The action is there in this HeroQuest expansion! The heroes embark on a perilous journey into a society populated by ogres to prevent Zargon from corrupting their people. With 7 modernized classic quests, 3 entirely original quests, exclusive figurines and a new way to play in tournaments.

Content :

Book containing 10 quests
28 Premium figures
28 cards
Game sheet
Game sheet (arena)

member Giuseppe Rotondo Axian suggests "feulle de jeu" here means "tile."

If accurate, this follows what a lot of folks were imagining with the "Arena" being a special room tile where this "mode" takes place ("a new way to play" as Avalon Bill put it). But what of the 28 figures... that seems like way more than the classic era ATOH! I am guessing that includes all plastic... so any furniture, bits or dice would be included too, but what could they be? I thought we had abandoned the idea of WOM and ATOH being combined into one set? Is the Arena mode going to function like a mini-expansion?

59.90 Euro converts to 64.97 USD which seems a little more expensive than the $44.99 we're used to with the others. We've already seen the real box size and it doesn't look any bigger than MOTM/FH/ROTDM.

[Jabie]

Personal opinions:

* Bin the tokens and give me cards, please! One consistent approach to bad guy spells please.

* Bin the variable Body Points. It was a rubbish mechanic which meant that an Ogre Champion might die in one hit whereas an Ogre Warrior could have zillions of hit points. It made no sense and was the first thing we killed off when we played back in the day.

* You can't shop between adventures, but you do get to rest up between each quest. And the heroes each get five full-heal potions because these quest are ruddy tough.

* If someone dies, you find another hero who just happened to escape the Ogre Lord's dungeons. It's alsmost like Loretome knew this was their destiny.

* Command type effects can't make heroes (or named Villains) commit suicide. They're called HEROES for a reason and the universe just doesn't work that way! Henchmen and goons, on the other hand, are fair game.

[Nickolaidas]

Did you guys see the leaked images of the box's back? It shows miniatures and everything.

www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Ft4whvodc10fc1.png

[Chwat]

was posted here yesterday arternoon

[Nickolaidas]

was posted here yesterday arternoon

I just saw it on the general discussion, my bad!

[Kurgan]

Personal opinions:

* Bin the variable Body Points. It was a rubbish mechanic which meant that an Ogre Champion might die in one hit whereas an Ogre Warrior could have zillions of hit points. It made no sense and was the first thing we killed off when we played back in the day.

Good comments, and respectfully of course, but the special "boss" Ogres (Champion, Chieftain, Lord) had their own separate tracks from the general track for just the Warriors (1-4 BP for those), right?

I agree that you shouldn't suicide your enemies in this game, but Morcar (through the sorcerer) could take control of a hero and force him to walk into the "Pit of Chaos" and thus control him "forever." Maybe he could make him walk off a bridge too, but yeah you could assume self preservation just as a monster wouldn't do that. I guess you might be repeating a certain question a few times possibly (I think always at least one hero would be free to win the fight, would he be forced to kill his comrades or being slain by them?). At least the NA/Remake rules have the "Elixir of Life" that could theoretically restore any dead hero even if he was offed by falling into a "bottomless" pit (albeit probably without any gear).

I would have been fine with both tokens AND cards for the spells (and the "big potions" too in fact, though you just wrote them down in the original). I presume Avalon Hill would wisely consider the desires and opinions of EU players first on these things, so if you all wanted them badly enough I'm sure they will have taken that into account! "New Ways to play" seem to be the order of the day, so we'll see if it's all woven together in one tightly woven package or if they give us options.

[wallydubbs]

Good comments, and respectfully of course, but the special "boss" Ogres (Champion, Chieftain, Lord) had their own separate tracks from the general track for just the Warriors (1-4 BP for those), right?

I would have been fine with both tokens AND cards for the spells (and the "big potions" too in fact, though you just wrote them down in the original). I presume Avalon Hill would wisely consider the desires and opinions of EU players first on these things, so if you all wanted them badly enough I'm sure they will have taken that into account! "New Ways to play" seem to be the order of the day, so we'll see if it's all woven together in one tightly woven package or if they give us options.

Actually the Variable Body Points system worked on all the ogres except for the Ogre Lord.

They COULD add the tokens for good-ol' times sake, as in the traditional way to play. But by Alternative way to play, they could just be referring to an alternative system deviating from the Variable Body Points and tokens. The method of play is optional.

Though originally when I heard "Alternative Gameplay" my mind thought of a possible Arena Mode, battling heroes and/or monsters 1 on 1 in the field or possibly a gauntlet. I've toyes with this idea, like the Barbarian vs. Knight or Monk vs. Elf, stuff like that

[Kurgan]

Check out the other thread here with new images and updated info on the (finished) pack coming out soon!