The Bryan Ansell Interview Feb/2013

[cornixt]

I've heard about the Warhammer chariot racing game before, and I've seen pictures of some of the unreleased models for it - from what I remember they didn't look all that different from the normal chariots of the time. I don't remember where I saw them though, possibly an oldhammer site

GW did release rules for chariot race mini games using their chariots on their website in the 2000s, which I'd guess were nothing like whatever the other game was meant to be since it was basically Warhammer rules with a few exceptions.

[lestodante]

...I believe Stephen Baker did come up with the game screen and basic concept of one player controlling the monsters and dungeon set up while the heroes play cooperative style exploration for MB, borrowed directly from true RPGs such as D&D and Warhammer Fantasy Role Play, basically a simplified version of dungeon crawling scenarios popular in the early days of D&D. D&D evolved to encompass many unique styles of play and whole worlds as environs later, a system to turn a theater of the mind without boundaries into gameplay, originally it was literally dungeon crawling/treasure seeking in a labyrinth, only much more complex in its rules, stats and possibilities than a board game. (Gygax and Arneson created all that, Baker didn't.)I believe he came up with the innovative folding board design of HQ with blank dungeon map which can be set up in any configuration with tiles and furniture making unlimited unique quests possible. He did turn an RPG into a boardgame. Truly remarkable..........

Totally agree with all your post!

[Daedalus]

I've heard about the Warhammer chariot racing game before, and I've seen pictures of some of the unreleased models for it - from what I remember they didn't look all that different from the normal chariots of the time. I don't remember where I saw them though, possibly an oldhammer site . . .

I found the site. Also, here's the BGG thread cornixt remembers.

[Cael Darkhollow]

I've heard about the Warhammer chariot racing game before, and I've seen pictures of some of the unreleased models for it - from what I remember they didn't look all that different from the normal chariots of the time. I don't remember where I saw them though, possibly an oldhammer site . . .

I found the site. Also, here's the BGG thread cornixt remembers.

Interesting that many of those prototypes made it into Warhammer armies instead. That's funny to me because I was all excited to see them and I actually own some of the production versions already.

[Daedalus]

. . . In the field of fantasy, the existing games were stuff that ended up late at night. Instead, I liked the idea of ​​creating a Talisman-style game that was suitable for people between nine and eleven.. . .

Stephen Baker mentions Talisman as an influence/inspiration. What Talisman vestiges are evident in Hero Quest? Talisman's adventure cards (many with Gary Chalk art) have random good and bad outcomes; this can be seen in Hero Quest's Treasure Card deck. Both games use random player movement on a board. Both games have spells that are discarded when cast. Similar to Hero Quest, Talisman Heroes are generally created with ten points, though split between Strength, Craft, and Life. And both games progress heroes through gear; Talisman's purchase deck is equivalent to HQ's equipment cards/Armory.

The big question: how did HeroQuest evolve?

'I was always interested in the fantasy genre from my days at Games Workshop. When I went to work for MB I discussed this with Roger Ford (head of Project Development at MB) and he game me the go-ahead to develop the project with the proviso that it be kept simple enough to appeal to a large audience.

How did Games Workshop get involved?

'Initially we just wanted them to do the plastic miniatures, but they've had so much experience in the fantasy field we decided to draw on their expertise.' . . .

The odd composition of Bryan Ansell's bag 'o prototype Hero Quest figures makes more sense knowing of the Talisman connection; they all resemble existing characters fromTalisman 2nd edition (1983) and certain expansions (1984-1989.) The barbarian, dwarf, wizard and elf figures were retained through modified forms in HQ. The knights appear to have evolved into the Warrior of Advanced Heroquest; the dwarf, wizard and elf were more directly adapted to characters for AHQ, as well. Finally, the chaos warrior appeared as a character pack in Warhammer Quest.

The fact that these Talisman-related figures were floating around GW before Bryon Ansell took them and left in 1991 provides us with a clue as to what GW "expertise" Baker and MB decided to "draw on." It is apparent GW was at the least playtesting Hero Quest, but it is even more likely that Jervis Johnson and GW helped "rescue" the Baker prototype as Ansell alleges and the White Dwarf preview confirms. The Talisman board game, an applicable part GW's "experience in the fantasy field", can still be seen in the final version of HQ.

[Pancho]

Good points about the similarities in detail between Heroquest and Talisman. A few years back I somehow managed to persuade my wife to play BOTH games with me over the space of two weekends. After playing Talisman she said that “they are really similar, pretty much the same game”. I couldn’t really see what she meant, as I’ve been playing for years and can only see the differences, but there must have been at least some truth behind her claim.

[cornixt]

Talisman is far simpler than HQ. There is very little decision making - every few turns you might get to choose whether you pick to fight a known creature or draw a card, rather than the usual turn action of drawing a card.

I think that both were very much influenced by early DnD classes that were mixed between human professions and race. My set had the following: Cleric, Fighter, Magic User, Thief, Dwarf, Elf, Halfling.

[Davane]

Or is the term "D&D" here being used generically to refer to "fantasy Role Playing game" as opposed to "fantasy themed board game" (and what's the difference)?

Pretty much this. It's worth noting that, particularly back in the days, D&D evolved out of a miniatures wargame called Chainmail. Miniatures wargaming has existed for a LONG time, given it has immense strategic value, but there has long been an ideological split between what is a miniatures wargame and what is a board game. A lot of it has to deal with the quality of the miniatures themselves, as many would refute that chess pieces counted as miniatures in any way.

It's worth noting that this ideological split continues today in board games, as you compare "Eurogames" with their love of wooden Meeples, to the lovingly-named "Ameri-Trash" games which are noted for their use of plastic miniatures. By this definition alone, HeroQuest in all it's incarnations has been "Ameri-Trash"...

In general, HQ is seen to have been attempting to become more roleplaying/wargaming based than board game based, which would have been in important distinction at the time where a growing RPG market was no longer being demonised by the religious right, and where board games were still considered to be simplistic "toys" like Snakes and Ladders, Monopoly, and Chess...

Contrast that to now where, although such simple board games still exist, there is a growing market for complex board games by board games enthusiasts, and thus HQ is supposedly sliding AWAY from roleplaying/wargaming in favour of it's board game roots once again...

[Kurgan]

Siege of Bondenburg : gaming history!

Throughout my childhood I never played any wargames (born at the wrong time), but I did enjoy the miniatures I got in souvenir shops and saw advertised in the back of comic books from the 70s. Of course ours weren't made of lead (and fear of lead paint caused many parents of our generation to guide their kids to other toys instead).

Here's a sample of the kind of stuff we had (also there were mounted knights and I had one set that had a dragon on wheels). The bases were metal but the figures were plastic/hard rubber (weapons were removable) though surely based on metal originals.

As cool as it is to have specialized sets (and how profitable to sell them), I kind of like the old idea of just taking whatever toys or models you have (or make yourself) to create a game.

medievalknightsbritain.jpg

[Pancho]

I had those guys! Loved them to death at the time. Great toys, and would make nice gaming figures (maybe with a bit of paint added to bring out the shading.

I’d happily play a game with someone using proxy miniatures. I’m not keen on players mixing wildly different figures (scale or style) on the same gaming table, but other than that I think proxies are a great idea. It’s all about removing obstacles so that we can continue to play great games that are now OOP.