Overview of the Old World

[Cael Darkhollow]

Warhammer, HeroQuest, Battlemasters, Advanced HeroQuest, Warhammer Quest, Talisman 3rd etc. all share the same setting and basic fantasy Tolkienesque/pseudohistoryEurope background and the figures are largely compatible with only minor style differences.
The game world settings are nearly identical with few discrepancies, retcons, or minor contradictions across any off those games. They are all based off and occur in the GamesWorkshop Old World.
Only the mechanical game rules themselves are different. As someone who owns them all and frequently rereads them, they are all essentially the same and I consider HQ a part of that world as I'm sure the developers, sculptors, designers, artists and writers did.

[Pancho]

Yep, what he said.

[Kurgan]

Some of us have a pretty relaxed attitude about what to incorporate or not, but let's say someone wanted to:

1) Mesh the Warhammer fantasy world with Hero Quest while playing Hero Quest.

2) Doesn't have an encyclopedic knowledge of WHF already.

3) Doesn't have the time/money/desire to gain that knowledge through seeking out and collecting all the literature on the topic from ebay or memorize the wikis.

Would you guys be willing to whip up and share some kind of (free) handy guide/cheat sheet for GMs to use in that case? This goes double for those wanting to do something similar with the 2021 Remake edition. In other words, something specifically for Heroquest players.

I'm not talking about taking new things and adding them, I'm talking about the context and "rules" you feel are tied in. That would make it a lot less daunting task for those wishing to do what you're talking about.

Just throwing that suggestion out there!

[j_dean80]

Well I’m having a read through the books to see what “fits”. They are long and can be tedious though.

[Pancho]

Some of us have a pretty relaxed attitude about what to incorporate or not, but let's say someone wanted to:

1) Mesh the Warhammer fantasy world with Hero Quest while playing Hero Quest.

2) Doesn't have an encyclopedic knowledge of WHF already.

3) Doesn't have the time/money/desire to gain that knowledge through seeking out and collecting all the literature on the topic from ebay or memorize the wikis.

Would you guys be willing to whip up and share some kind of (free) handy guide/cheat sheet for GMs to use in that case? This goes double for those wanting to do something similar with the 2021 Remake edition. In other words, something specifically for Heroquest players.

I'm not talking about taking new things and adding them, I'm talking about the context and "rules" you feel are tied in. That would make it a lot less daunting task for those wishing to do what you're talking about.

Just throwing that suggestion out there!

I’m not exactly sure what you mean Kurgan.

Heroquest as written is already meshed with Warhammer fantasy. If you use the maps that are provided (in both games) you can’t go far wrong in terms of setting your locations. We already have motivations for the monsters and their leaders from the published HQ stuff. The questbooks also give us a good idea of the various threats to the Empire and where each comes from.

Or are you asking for more detail, I.e how the Empire is organised politically, names of the various green skin tribes, all the types of Undead etc, etc. If so, I’m not sure how that sort of thing would fit on a cheat sheet

[Bareheaded Warrior]

When I first started to play HeroQuest back around Xmas 1989 and the 2-3 years that followed it, our group was fully immersed in the GW Warhammer world as it was then (and had a copy of WFRP with all that background material to mine for info)

However having now introduced HeroQuest to a new generation or two, they don't know or particularly want to know about this rich background so my question is, if you don't want to position HeroQuest in a Warhammer world, does anyone have any suggestions about a simpler setting to immerse it in?

Two or three years ago I removed overt references to GW stuff for my house rules (ironically a similar process to the "new" HQ version that is coming out / is out shortly and I fully expect to get the same less than positive response) when introducing it to the next generation - so Fimir became Troll, Chaos Warriors became Dark Warriors but were rapidly nicknamed 'Slayers' which I liked, Chaos Magic = Dark Magic etc.

[Kurgan]

The main question is: are the WH fans here asking HQ players to use more WH in their HQ... or are they just wanting to talk about how great WH is and they wish more people appreciated it like they do? Not starting a franchise war here, there's room for everyone, but if they want to spread the good word, so to speak, here's one way to do that.

I’m not exactly sure what you mean Kurgan.

Heroquest as written is already meshed with Warhammer fantasy. If you use the maps that are provided (in both games) you can’t go far wrong in terms of setting your locations. We already have motivations for the monsters and their leaders from the published HQ stuff. The questbooks also give us a good idea of the various threats to the Empire and where each comes from.

Or are you asking for more detail, I.e how the Empire is organised politically, names of the various green skin tribes, all the types of Undead etc, etc. If so, I’m not sure how that sort of thing would fit on a cheat sheet

I'm asking because if you come to Hero Quest as-is, you don't have any understanding of the context of those references in that map as they would appear in the Warhammer fantasy lore. That's what I'm talking about. Threads like these exist because some players are passionate that there needs to be more Warhammer in Hero Quest (unless I'm misunderstanding them). How are players supposed to "get" that, without playing both games, or studying the books of the other franchise? So providing a "cliffs notes" (anybody remember those? or how about those readers digest book summaries/paraphrases?) of the WH stuff for HQ players who want to use it seems logical. If it's only for homebrew stuff, then I guess it's not needed. Yeah there's a world map 'n' stuff, now don't bother me, type of thing.

Had no one translated the Japanese HQ, I wouldn't have known about any such thing as a "chaos god" exist in this world, but to learn about what that means in WH, I have to read WH, or somebody has to tell me, right?

I'm thinking a PDF file, boiling down the material from all those dozens of books people have listed to just what would be relevant to playing the game and what is "possible" within those parameters. Again it's just an idea, since it seems there was some desire for other non-WH players to try or embrace this lore.

So it could be as simple or as extensive as you want it to be. A "Cheat Sheet" wouldn't cover vast histories, but sort of like that description of the monsters at the end of the game system quest book, it could provide context to things, it could provide one-to-one name conversions or anecdotes that might impact gameplay. It would require some discernment and work, but that's the sort of thing that you guys like to do, right? I'm not willing to do it, because that's not my interest, I'm just making a helpful suggestion (and you guys are already here).

If you want a guideline, how about limiting yourself to the WH material that was released at the time the HQ games were released. Then again, there's nothing stopping other versions from incorporating more modern material (there's a new Hero Quest coming out I hear...).

If you feel that Hero Quest is fine the way it is and needs no further explanation, then no worries...

[cornixt]

Any basic description of the Old World would be a bit more than a page but it probably wouldn't have the level of detail you'd want to write a quest (try the Old World section of https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wik ... mmer_World or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer ... y_(setting)). Use it as a starting point to know where to research more.

If you want quests based on certain creatures, then you'd want to start with a bestiary (maybe https://warhammerfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Races)

For models in those quests, the Warhammer Underworlds games has sets of a few models that look really good and have individual character. They all come with 32mm bases and tend to be a bit spread out, but they are better value than buying the AoS sets.

You should probably grab the text as soon as you can and store it offline (or on here) for editing, there have been a lot of losses of material caused by the people in control losing interest and letting the websites lapse, or well-meaning people trying to tidy things by eliminating what they see as unnecessary.

[Kurgan]

If it's not about creating any new quests, just reinterpreting the existing official stuff in light of that other franchise, I would think you could break it up into a few sections:

The WORLD: A quick history, major regions.
The FACTIONS: Summary of the different factions.
Subsection here could be "the Peoples" or "Races" if you want.
MAGIC: What it is.

What more would you need? Certainly not mechanics, because we've already got that here in HQ. Zargon/Morcar and Mentor don't really exist in WHF (though various analogs have been proposed), but could exist. Is Morcar some kind of chaos warrior? Are they "gods"? of some kind? You tell me.

Heroquest Official:

Game System (plus training quest "the Maze" from 1st ed) - more storyline material appears in the EU editions than the NA, including the world map
Kellar's Keep
Return of the Witch Lord
Against the Ogre Horde
Wizards of Morcar
The Dark Company
Mage of the Mirror ??
Frozen Horror ??
Japan Game system

anything new in the 2021 Remake. (this will be the controversial one, leave it out if you like)

official: but not part of any quest pack release
(Dave Morris novels)
A Growl of Thunder
Running the Gauntlet

(Marvel Comics Winter Special)
Revenge of the Weather Man

(White Dwarf published)
Eyes of Chaos
Halls of Durrag-Dol
Inn of Chaos

HeroQuest II: Legacy of Sorasil PC game (you could probably leave this one out as well, since it's only loosely inspired by the franchise as a whole, even if it is meant to follow the first PC game which is a hybrid of EU 1st ed. GS+ROTWL with some features of the NA versions).

You could also probably leave out Advanced Hero Quest and its expansions, but because of the stronger WHF ties, maybe you'd want to include that too (Skaven, folks!).


Not counting stuff from other magazines like Adventures Unlimited or Dragão Dourado magazines since those (as far as I know) would be fan-zines, not official sources.

Anything in there that sticks out to you as a crooked nail, could be banged out with your knowledge of what's possible within WHF's world.

Actually you could make a "Warhammer Fantasy bible" for HQ, another for AHQ, and one for Battlemasters. You're not seeking to unify all games, you're just trying to show what WHF someone "ought" to have in mind while playing that game, if they want to be all WH-y.


I'm not the one to make this, I'm saying you guys who are already experts, should do it. If you care to, that is! Share it all over the web, print it out... it would be a fan supplement, a booklet, a condensed guide in and of itself. We already have wikis for warhammer fans. This would specifically be for HQ fans who are not trying to become WH experts.

[Davane]

Kurgan, HQ is set in the Warhammer World, and thus there will be those of us who come to HQ from this approach. As such, there will be people looking for more details about the Warhammer World for use with HQ, and this thread kind of serves to help with a jumping off point for people wanting more information. Just looking at the majority of fan quests here at Ye Olde Inn, you can get a sense of just how many have been inspired by the Warhammer World. It's good to note this fact, so you can differentiate what is direct HQ lore, what is part of the wider Warhammer World, what is fan headcanon, and so on.

Nobody can force anyone to use any specific interpretation of the HQ world, but a shared understanding of the world and its inspiration helps people come together over basic fundamentals of the setting, and a shared jumping off point. It's kind of useful if Official Sources at least have this understanding, unless they are prepared to share their own Official Replacement for the setting for everyone to get behind.

The angst of NuHQ comes from the fact that a considerable part of the HQ community are concerned about the direction NuHQ will be going in without possible access to the Warhammer World which served as the basis for HQ. This has caused much debate within the more general discussion threads, where you get slight conflict between those who see HQ as part of the Warhammer World and those who don't, largely because those who do will experience greater uncertainty, change, and a sense of loss from the new release.

What I have to ask though, Kurgan, is why do you feel the need to come into specific Warhammer World-based threads, and remind people that HQ is open to interpretation by all, even without Warhammer, as if there's some blasphemy in even mentioning the Warhammer World in relation to HQ. It seems redundant, both because this aspect of HQ is fairly obvious in itself, and because this is a specific Warhammer World thread, so presumably some desire to talk about and involve the Warhammer World is implied when taking part. Thus, I have to question WHY you feel the need to ask if this thread is about asking HQ players to use more Warhammer, or to evangalise about the Warhammer World.

The key to using the Warhammer World in HQ, is to do what people have been doing with campaign settings since the 70's and the beginnings of D&D - take what you want from it, and discard the rest. In general, it's often better to take the broad strokes of the setting, and not to necessarily worry about any of the big historical changes that may have occurred in the vast timeline of the Warhammer World. After all, many games from the franchise will easily pick and choose their lore as suits their purposes - be it from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay (still going strong under Cubicle 7), from AHQ and Warhammer Quest, the sheer amount of army books and campaign books, even through to games like Mordheim. Then there's the lore from the Total War games, or from any of the other video games if they take your fancy (remember Shadow's of the Horned Rat, anyone).

GW threw the Warhammer World under a bus when they came out with Age of Sigmar, but many fans still still use the Warhammer World as if that fateful final campaign never took place (or failed in ending the world). Some people have their preferred areas of Warhammer - like when Halflings were still a thing, or the "golden age era" of the 80's (when the Old World was still being explored) and/or 90's GW (when the larger Warhammer World was still being explored).

But the adage for RPG campaign settings remains the same - there's always room for new. No campaign setting takes the time to detail every burg and bramble, so there's always another cave, another dungeon, and another quest to explore. This might not relieve the angst of where Hasbro is taking the game with NuHQ, but it does mean that you'll always be able to play your favourite games, and there will always be people wanting to share content from their favourite games with others.

I should point out that the average campaign guide for any decently sized campaign world with the history of the Warhammer World, would be at least 250+ pages long. We're talking Hardback sized products here, not a simple overview. Even the broadest introduction could fill a 20+ page chapter, and still barely scratch the surface of the setting. A cheat sheet would be next to useless to anyone besides a complete novice, as it would be little more than a glossary and index of key terms used in the campaign.

A better approach may be to open a Warhammer World subforum here, and maybe work on a FAQ list for people wanting to know more about the Warhammer World. Individual research is strongly recommended, because there is no real one-size fits all approach for Warhammer, let alone how that relates to HQ, but a list of FAQs could help focus on those elements of Warhammer that are deemed most important for quest building in HQ...