Ye Olde Inn

Spells can be declared as re-cast, boosted, or maximized with the Cast A Spell action.  To do so Staff of Sorcery must be held (see below), and a number of combat dice are rolled from 1 up to as much as a Hero's current Mind Point total.  Each skull counts as a success. Successes don't accumulate, and dice may not be added after the initial roll.  A spell costs 1 or more successes to re-cast or boost, depending on its casting number (ex. Veil of Mist = 1 success, Genie = 4 successes). Maximizing a spell costs double the number of successes.  

In one turn, a spell may also be re-cast and boosted at double the cost, or it may be re-cast and maximized at triple the cost.  Failing to boost or maximize a spell uses an action, but the spell itself is not used up if still available.  Re-tries are allowed as a new action.

The following items can now be purchased between Quests from a new table, The Wizard's College:

A Staff of Sorcery may be purchased for 200-800 gold coins.  Like the Staff from the Armory, it gives the strength of 1 combat die and may be used diagonally, but may not be used with a shield.  The Wizard's Staff artifact may be enchanted with any Staff of Sorcery ability for the listed cost. Staves of Sorcery differ in name, cost, and benefit as follows:

A Lesser Staff of Sorcery may be purchased for 200 gold coins.  A Wizard may re-cast spells while it is held. While re-casting, lose 1 Mind Point for every white or black shield rolled.

A Greater Staff of Sorcery may be purchased for 400 gold coins.  A Wizard may re-cast and/or boost spells while it is held.  While re-casting, lose 1 Mind Point for every white shield rolled.  While boosting, lose 1 Mind point for every white or black shield rolled.

A Master Staff of Sorcery may be purchased for 800 gold coins.  A Wizard may re-cast, boost, and/or maximize spells while it is held.  While re-casting, lose 1 Mind Point for every black shield rolled. While boosting, lose 1 Mind Point for every white shield rolled.  While maximizing, lose 1 Mind Point for every white or black shield rolled.

Additionally, here are some artifacts:

Arcane Diadem  The attuned crystal mounted in this golden headband magnifies a spellcaster's powers, halving the casting number of a spell down to a minimum of one (round up).  The Arcane Diadem works only once per Quest.

Sylvan Staff (Lesser, Greater, or Master)  These magical staves work exactly like thier Staff of Sorcery counterparts and may be used by the Elf.

Elemental Foci are affixed to a Staff of Sorcery and each may be swapped out for a different focus between Quests. The four Elemental Foci and their powers are:

Ember Focus The casting number of Fire spells is reduced by 1 while the casting number of Water spells is increased by 1.

Vapor Focus The casting number of Air spells is reduced by 1 while the casting number of Earth spells is increased by 1.

Geode Focus The casting number of Earth spells is reduced by 1 while the casting number of Air Spells is increased by 1.

Auqueous Focus The casting number of Water spells is reduced by 1 while the casting number of Fire spells is increased by 1.

Ideally, spell cards would need to be redone showing the casting number of each spell, as well as boosting and maximizing effects.  Otherwise a reference sheet with the spells listed below would suffice.
 
                                                Hero Elemental Spells

          Veil of Mist (1)                                Sleep (3)                         Water of Healing (5)
Boost- Hero remains unseen        Boost- monster rolls 1red die      Boost- affects 2 allies
   until the caster's next turn;         for every 2 Mind Points           Maximize- affects target and
   attacking ends the spell           Maximize- affects target and         any ally adjacent to the
Maximize- as Boost, plus               and any monster adjacent           target                    
   affects any ally in the room         to the target (not undead)
   or corridor                                  

           Rock Skin (2)                       Pass Through Rock (1)                   Heal Body (5)
Boost- cast 2 'layers' of 1             Boost- lasts for next 2 moves     Boost- restores 8 Body
   combat die each                      Maximize- cast on target and        Points, up to starting
Maximize- as Boost, plus               any adjacent allies                      number
   affects any ally adjacent to                                                       Maximize- as Boost, plus
   the target                                                                                   cast on 2 allies

              Genie (4)                               Swift Wind (1)                           Tempest (2)
Boost- alternatively can open       Boost- roll 3x as many red          Boost- lasts 2 turns
   1 chest/turn; lasts 2 turns           dice as normal on next            Maximize- affects target
Maximize- as Boost and use            move                                        square and its 4 adjacent
   8 combat dice to attack a         Maximize- cast on target and        squares
   monster; alternatively can           any adjacent allies
   fly 1 Hero over a trap/turn 

        Fire of Wrath (2)                           Courage (2)*                         Ball of Flame (3)
Boost- cast on any 2                    Boost- lasts for next 2               Boost- inflicts 1 Body Point
   monsters                                    attacks                                     of damage to a figure and
Maximize- as Boost and              Maximize- lasts until the               each adjacent figure
   inflicts 2 Body Points of               Hero can no longer "see" a      Maximize- as Boost but
   damage to each monster             monster                                    inflicts 2 Body Points of 
                                                                                                     damage to each figure

                                                             Courage (5)*
                                                 Boost- cast on 2 allies
                                                 Maximize- affects any ally in
                                                    the room or corridor           

* use 2 if good for 1 attack only, use 5 if applies against multiple monsters

                                                            Chaos Spells

               Fear (2)                                      Sleep (3)                             Command (4)    
Boost- roll only 1 red die for        Boost- monster rolls 1red die      Boost- roll only 1 red die for  
   every 2 Mind Points                    for every 2 Mind Points              every 2 Mind Points
Maximize- as Boost and              Maximize- affects target and      Maximize- affects 2 Heroes
   affects all Heroes in a                 and any monster adjacent                               
   room or corridor                         to the target (not undead)                               

            Tempest (2)                                   Rust (3)                                 Escape (3)              
Boost- lasts 2 turns                     Boost- affects any 2 Helmets      Boost- teleport caster and
Maximize- affects target                or swords; not effective             an adjacent figure
   square and its 4 adjacent             against artifacts                    Maximize- teleport any
   squares                                   Maximize- as Boost but                 figures in a room or
                                                     affects any metal items             corridor

      Summon Undead (5)                       Summon Orcs (5)                  Cloud of Chaos (5)
Boost- roll 2 red dice for              Boost- elite Orcs' with stats        Boost- roll only 1 red die for
   two seperate results                    the same as Firmirs                   every 2 Mind Points
Maximize- roll 4 red dice,            Maximize- as Boost and roll        Maximize- as Boost and lose
   adding 2 to each result                 2 red dice, adding 2 to the        1 Body Point per turn
                                                     result

        Ball of Flame (3)                          Lightning Bolt (5)                     Firestorm (6)
Boost- inflicts 1 Body Point          Boost- cast 2 bolts in                  Boost- monsters adjacent to
   of damage to a figure and           different directions                    the caster are unaffected;
   each adjacent figure                Maximize- cast an 90 degree         inflicts 4 Body Points dam.
Maximize- as Boost but                  arcing bolt that inflicts 3         Maximize- as Boost but
   inflicts 2 Body Points of               Body Points of damage               inflicts 5 Body Points dam.
   damage to each figure                                                                 -roll 3 red dice to reduce


Comments:

There's some tactical choice in deciding the number of dice to roll.  Roll too few, and the spell isn't re-cast, boosted, or maximized, wasting an action.  Rolling too many increases the chance of shields which weaken a caster and may eventually put him into shock.  As drinking restoration/vitality potions returns Mind Points, financial access to these potables makes a caster more powerful by extension.  I think drathe's reduction of most potion costs by 4/5 would work well with this. 

It isn't necessary to include boosting or maximizing, though those options at higher levels definitely increase tactical choice for spell-casters. Simply allowing re-casting alone with the casting numbers of the spells provides a significant increase in a spellcaster's arsenal. Small stickers with the spells' casting numbers at the bottom of the spell cards would also be easier to implement.

The Chaos spells generally won't see a lot of boosting and maximizing due to thier high cost. Certain Quests can get around this by including an artifact or local effect that reduces the prohibitively-high casting cost of a featured spell or two.

Finally, for the most part this hasn't been play-tested, so things aren't set in stone. Constructive criticism is welcome, especially that which pertains to the power increase in spells and their casting numbers.  I realize this system significantly complicates spell-casting, but I hope the tactical choices included appeal to a few folks.

Thats great for advanced players,
but it is a bit rules heavy for the intermediate and basic crowd I would wager.

Got a basic rules set for these concepts? I like what I see but if I can't explain it to a 12 year old in a couple sentances I will just loose the kid rapidly.

Yeah, it isn't geared toward kids. For a rules-lite version, I'd go with the original concept of just re-casting spells. You can go with an artifact card or explain the rule using its last three sentences:



You'd then need to write the casting numbers of each spell (from the main post) on small stickers and place them on the bottom of thier respective cards or sleeves. If messing with your spell cards is unthinkable, then make a table just including the spell names and thier casting numbers.
Thanks for the input. This rules-lite version (more like the other post I linked in your Wizard-Buffing thread) is more HeroQuest friendly and should have broader appeal.

This is very similar to the idea I used in my expanded HQ rules. I even originally had the issue of losing
a mind point for a failure of successfully re-casting a spell. That way, at some point, it would become
dangerous for the character to attempt, and kept the unbalancing of power to a minimum.

I think I took that part out, though. I just increase the number of skulls needed each time until it becomes
impossible to re-cast any spells, simply because the player can't roll enough dice. Of course, if you allow the
increase of mind points, then eventually they'll still be able to cast quite a few spells more than once.

I do like your idea, daedalus - even with the intricacy of the rules, it is very close to the "spirit" of HQ, and you
even managed to mix the ability to re-cast along with the ability to increase the power of the spells. I never figured
a way to do that...I always had that as an entirely completely ability and roll.

I'll keep my rules for my expanded HQ rules - which, really, isn't even HQ anymore - I'm posting it still, just because.
If I ever get to playing HQ with others again, I may steal these rules, however...I like them for HQ play.

As I like to make the Heroes roll thier mind points on some things I could see the mage thinking long and hard if he wants to risk the mind points by ussing the staff.

An even more basic version comes to mind.
Each spell cast, may be recast at a latter time if the mage sacrifices a point of mind to save the spell with the staff at the time of casting the spell the first time. Each Spell may only be recast one time via the staff.

torilen-
I'm not surprised that we both went at the same issue from different angles, since we both want to push the limits of the game while making an effort to remain HQ-grounded. I'm headed in your direction, collecting a mass of house-rules to create a HQ/quasi-roleplaying experience. Of course, most of us are doing the same thing in various degrees while remaining fixed to individual tastes. It's fun to realize the game as something more.

It's nice to have other board members comment and bring me back to the basics when I stray too far or get unclear. Maybe I'll remain passionate/obsessed enough to collect everything and post a document download link as you did (did I just call you obsessed? ) . I'd most like to include basic rules and advanced rules to hopefully satisfy myself and a broader group.

I wonder if it would be worthwhile to ultimately present such rules, both basic and advanced, as the Dungeons and Dragons (Red Box) Starter Set or the Pathfinder Begginner Box. It might be a good way to learn the rules...while playing Quests!

I am very partial to introducing the more complex rules as part of a quest.

{In the RPG my group plays, they are just now ready to be introduced to ranged combat.
They are in for some rude awakenings this weekend.
Pissed off Dwarves with cross bows... this is not going to be friendly.}

cyndi - actually, adding a rule during the quests might be one of the best ways to introduce new rules.
say you have two or three normal quests - then add a rule during the fourth quest. The players learn
how to use the rule in that quest - give them lots of reasons to use it, and make it easy for them to
use it at the time. Then, make it a little hard with the next two quests. By the end of the sixth quests,
they've got the new rule down pretty good - then they'll be ready for a new rule during the seventh quest.

* * * * *

not to get the thread too far off base...

@daedalus - you can call me obsessed. I've actually been working on my own gaming system for a few years
now. I've gone back and forth between basing it basic D&D and HQ, and have finally come up with the version
I have now. It it mostly based on HQ, with some aspects of basic D&D thrown in (this is visible in the actions
that are more rpg-like, the kind of stuff that isn't used in combat at all...like blacksmithing and woodworking).

I've actually gotten my system to where I want it. I just need to finish typing things up - mostly the monsters
right now...and then reword all the spells...and then add the fluff material to things. Then it will be complete,
and I can start selling it. I have recently been trying to figure out a good starter game - and adventure that will
be compiled of what I call scenarios (much like the quests in HQ).

As I said - my system is really has a only a vague resemblance to HQ any longer. Just remember - if you plan to try
to do anything with yours, try to change small things enough that it is different, rename everything, and you should
be good to go. Just be careful that you're not using thought-out ideas from people here - and if you are, check with
them before you try selling anything.
I've had to do that with one aspect of mine - no trouble, thank goodness, because I wasn't sure what I would've done
otherwise.

I am also a game designer.
My RPG is curently almost complete.
All I need is for my artists to turn in their art and to go through the manual and do a final edit.

I have put my play test manual on Lulu so my game group can order manuals and not sit at the table with a stack of printed papers.

If anyone is interested PM me and I will send the link to the download. (it is like $4.75, I am not makeing any money off this endevour yet...)

Edit: Wife says she set it up so I get 50 cents per download. So it seems I inadvertantly lied on that last statement.

There is a perfect bound edition also, but I do make some money off that one....(a couple bucks per copy)

cynthialee wrote:As I like to make the Heroes roll thier mind points on some things I could see the mage thinking long and hard if he wants to risk the mind points by ussing the staff.

An even more basic version comes to mind.
Each spell cast, may be recast at a latter time if the mage sacrifices a point of mind to save the spell with the staff at the time of casting the spell the first time. Each Spell may only be recast one time via the staff.

I like the basic spend per spell idea. Been thinking along similar lines for another magic house rule that doesn't need an extra table or altered cards. I'm not there yet, as it took some time to come up with the tactically complex magic system above.

Right now, I have two problems with a direct spend per spell system. First, it seems to me that in the vast majority of circumstances the same spells will be repeatedly recast for the same generic Mind Point cost. To elaborate, I'll use my old group as an example. We stayed with the same spells for continuity, and the Elf always took Water spells. That means the Wizard would almost certainly select Heal Body, Genie, Ball of Flame, and Courage to recast, as they have the most impact on combat or survival. That would leave a Wizard just 1 more Mind Point to use on the other five spells, reducing meaningful decisions to 1 per Quest. Maybe that's not an much of an issue for others, but I'd prefer there to be more weighing of options. (Actually, I'd say it allows for 2 re-cast decisions per Quest as I now play Courage as lasting only 1 turn.)

The other problem I have is there's no leveling to speak of, which is something I'm after. A Wizard pretty much has 6 to 8 Mind Points, with only 5 to 7 available if he doesn't want to go into shock. Affordable potions could help a lot here, but I'd prefer to have some sort of innate progression, if possible. The problem is right now only a mana system seems to fit the bill, and I personally don't feel that's very HQ.

Anyway, I think your basic rule gives a lot efficiently, and I like it. If I can come up with an alternate solution meeting the criteria above, I'll post it. Otherwise, I just might have to give your vesion a try.