Ye Olde Inn

by **Kurgan** » Saturday February 1st, 2020 11:20am

So reading off the scans of the EU version of Quest 3 ("Lair of the Orc Warlord") vs the NA version I noticed some differences:

EU Version: 100 gold coins to the one who kills Ulag alone.
NA version: 180 gold coins to be divided when Ulag dies.
(And other treasure found may be kept by the finder alone)

NA Version: A: Hero finds Staff.
EU Version: C: Hero finds Spear.

NA Version: B: Hero finds 24 gold coins, Potion of Healing (+4)
EU Version: A: Hero finds 30 gold coins, Potion of Healing (+4)

NA Version: Unmarked chest. Empty?
EU Version: B: chest contains an unidentified trap (-1 Body) and 100 gold coins

So now we see that Phoenix's version is a faithful re-creation of the NA version, including this "error" of the unmarked chest. Clearly the NA map-makers goofed up and left out the entry.

NA Version: Ulag stats: has 2 body points
EU Version: Ulag stats: has 1 body point (like all monsters)

In the NA version a Fimir was moved from the room before the battle with Ulag to a formerly empty room. Two Goblins were added to Ulag's room.

"Premiere Edition" vs. EU Edition: no differences noted.

It will be interesting to see if the new HeroQuest Remake (of 2021) will implement these fixes. Supposedly there will be "minor changes" based on the NA version. Let's hope so! These were perfectly playable back in the day but it may have tripped up a few Zargon players at first back in the day as it does today when someone tries one of these quests for the first time.

by **The1Lion** » Monday September 28th, 2020 3:59pm

There are a lot of differences in each quest between the two versions. The spear isn't even in the original NA version.

by **Kurgan** » Tuesday September 29th, 2020 8:52am

Very true about the different weapons. I grew up with the NA version. I like to blend the two now, it feels more complete.

I posted a link to a bunch of quest map fixes here.

by **Kurgan** » Thursday September 2nd, 2021 11:09am

Uploaded the PDF version (without the text label since HeroScribe doesn't have that ability natively).

by **Kurgan** » Monday December 6th, 2021 2:11pm

The 2021 Remake simply re-copies the error without a fix! Well now you know what was supposed to be there...

by **Kurgan** » Thursday September 29th, 2022 3:51pm

We have confirmation now that the Remake released in France (retail edition) also repeats the error from the 2021 remake (repeated from the 1990 NA edition), despite what the classic French edition showed for that quest....

Thanks to Les Souterrains Oubliés (reported by DavidDup0nt in HeroQuestFans discord!): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mk5vktwbrDU&t=328s [spoilers]

by **Bareheaded Warrior** » Friday August 18th, 2023 4:54am

I find it interesting that the EA Editions were flawed because they assumed a more competitive, less co-operative style of play, so when players did co-operate more the game was too easy. This flaw was pointed out very early, Sep/Oct 1989, in a Games International review (along with a few others flaws) which also included fixes, specifically beefing up the monsters by adding more BP.

The NA Edition (and later HQ2021) effectively forced co-operation, so they did well to take this into account and include a fix by beefing up monster BP but then they boosted the gold yield, either directly by just increasing amounts, introducing the buy-back rule (can never remember when that was actually implemented) which effectively halved the cost of equipment, and allowing 4x the treasure searches (one per hero per room instead of one per room), and allowing the hoarding of potions which in combination effectively increased the rate of advancement eight-fold, making the game too easy.

Out of the frying pan into the fire!

In terms of this quest specifically I will do a proper analysis and rework and publish a polished map shortly, but moving a few monsters and adding a few Goblins doesn't make a huge difference, for me the biggest issue with this quest is that it is almost entirely linear lacking choice and exploration!

Again, I find the addition of the pit trap interesting, the original had no traps which is certainly odd, so I get the motivation of adding at last one, but the position of it makes no sense at all under NA Edition rules as a hero would just step into that room, search for treasure taking what was in the chest, without ever risking stepping onto the square with the trap. So they have effectively attempted to fix a flaw of no traps, by adding one trap that is unlikely to ever be noticed.

And the addition of the text "And other treasure found may be kept by the finder alone" is odd as it either implies that heroes cannot pass items between them in general, which we know they can and need to in later quests or it is specific to treasure items found in this quest, what is different about these potions to any other potion, are they coated in some sort of sticky glue?