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Witch Lord 1 shot

Discuss Quests, Cards, Monsters etc, from HeroQuest Game Systems.

Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby The Admiral » Monday October 7th, 2019 3:17am

I have been playing this game for almost 30 years now and that is sometimes how it goes. You will get a boss at some stage that you wish had died in one shot! As time goes by you will get a better feel of how hard a quest and boss are in relation to the strength of the Hero group, and you will be able to make minor or major adjustments either way accordingly. In your case some extra undead figures could have made a massive difference. But even then the luck of the dice can make any quest one sided.


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby Pancho » Monday October 7th, 2019 3:26am

Jalapenotrellis wrote:How many body points would you give him? Double? Or let him use a potion like the Heroes if suddenly one shot by their potion?

Personally I wouldn't give him a potion as I'm not a fan of changing rules and abilities on the spot - players don't like it and I think its much better to try and get the quest right in the first place then just let it play out (if the Heroes then roll really well or ace it tactically, then that's just the way it goes).

I don't have my game handy to check body points for the WL. But I know I have buffed pretty much all the main characters. Even the Guardian of Grin's Crag (Kellar's Keep) needs some special treatment.

You could straight up ask your players if they are finding it too easy. The game does get harder by the time you get to Against the Ogre Horde, but you'll have to play through KK and ROTWL before then, and some report that gaming groups break up through lack of interest at that point. I honestly don't think its a case of you having to adapt these on games on the spot, I think its a case of making quite small but nevertheless significant changes before the game gets underway.
I strongly recommend that you go through each thread of the sub-boards for each of the expansions and see what people are saying. Often there is a consensus on where the flaws lie, and the very simple changes that can be made to make the quests better. These are not big changes to the game itself, but tweaks to the special rules, traps etc. You could even keep a running thread for each expansion so that you get guidance from people that have played them a lot. I love those kinds of threads.


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby Jalapenotrellis » Monday October 7th, 2019 3:31am

Thanks for the advice, Pancho. I will check out some of the other subforms.
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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby wallydubbs » Monday October 7th, 2019 8:34am

I guess the best way to go about it is to not give the heroes his exact number of body points to avoid embarrassing situations like this.
As Zargon it's up to you to make it fun and challenging at the same time and there should be a level of trust that you won't put them in a situation of inescapable death (ie. Falling block traps that leave them stuck in a room forever), or make the boss unfairly difficult to the point of a TPK (total party kill). Remember, you're Zargon and you're supposed to lose.

I suggest you don't give away knowledge of his body points unless the heroes ask. If they do ask, use your discretion, make note of how well (or poorly) the heroes have done in this quest. If they're low on body points, keep your boss to a minimum, if they're doing quite well with sufficient Healing potions, feel free to raise his health.
In the case of a one shot kill, you can add a "Not So Fast", movement and give him a Potion of Healing.
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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby Tott » Monday October 7th, 2019 9:11am

Ive been playing many different games over the past 30 years and if theres one thing ive learnt its that the Goddess of Dice is a cruel and fickle mistress. the days she loves you, you cannot lose, other days, no matter what you do you're sunk.
such is life!
there are many ways to mitigate it in HQ that all involve home brews of some kind, your options include: increasing the bosses health points, increasing his defense dice or setting up some mechanic for a boss to increase the challange without making it too tough, for example:
Armoured: no attack can remove more than 1 HP at a time
Lord of the Dead: when ever the Witch Lord would Die, instead remove another undead monster from the board and leave the Witch Lord at 1 hp. if there are no other undead on the board, this ability cannot be used.
Honour Guard: the Witch lord cannot be harmed while any other Undead is in an adjacent square.

Your options are literally limited to your imagination. I found that the original HQ really didnt do too well when it comes to 'boss fights' theres a few quests where you have to kill an orc chief or champion or whatever and literally no-one even knew they were figthing him (you're supposed to use the orc with the big sword to represent him, but no-one actually noticed the sword!) primarily because their stats were exactly the same as any other Orcs. im a big fan of a health buff and a passive defensive ability for no other reason than you want to keep the boss characters around for more than one turn.
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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby Pancho » Monday October 7th, 2019 9:53am

Some nice suggestions there Tott. Your Lord of the Dead rule is very creative.

Wallydubbs, I've never agreed with the Zargon must always lose idea. I understand not being a dick and killing Heroes with loop-holes in the rules etc, but as long as it's fair I think it's great that Zargon/Morcar wins sometimes. It could even be thematic in this particular case, because the Witch Lord is due to return anyway - If he defeats the Heroes in Quest 14 that just sets up a fantastic grudge match later down the line, with the players having a shot at redeeming themselves.


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby The Admiral » Monday October 7th, 2019 10:45am

Pancho wrote:Personally I wouldn't give him a potion as I'm not a fan of changing rules and abilities on the spot - players don't like it and I think its much better to try and get the quest right in the first place then just let it play out (if the Heroes then roll really well or ace it tactically, then that's just the way it goes).


Absolutely. These days I have time to playtest our quests solo and then make any adjustments I feel are necessary, but always on the side that favours the Heroes. If the Heroes then do really well, then making it harder just because is punishment for good luck/play. On the other side of the coin, if they are having a mare, then they can die. I like to see what is in front of the Heroes play out in it's own way.


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby Anderas » Monday October 7th, 2019 11:50am

First, let him use the spell ring. It is in his pocket so why not using it.

Second, passing around the spirit blade? Yes that's worth a mod. Almost everyone here plays with passing equipment either only in the absence of monsters or at the beginning of the turn (before the action) or not at all during the quest.

Finally, no one would think that of you if you use a room mod. Put an Overlay on the board to have a bigger room. Good fights need good rooms.


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby lestodante » Monday October 7th, 2019 1:48pm

To all bosses should be applied the rule that they never lose more than 1 BP for each attack! This will prevent that "1 shot, 1 instant dead" situation.
Or at least apply this rule to magical bosses only.
Oh... and I remember that sad face on the GM when the greates of his creatures is killed without even beeing able to move... :shock: :? :cry:


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Re: Witch Lord 1 shot

Postby DullandRusty » Monday October 7th, 2019 10:47pm

We let bosses defend on white shields...makes things much harder
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