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A few questions on Orc's Bane

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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Jalapenotrellis » Sunday December 1st, 2019 1:10am

Really...wizard wearing Borin's armour (spelled the UK way), wielding Orc's Bane or the Spirit Blade? So basically the wizard could use a broadsword and a shortsword but not a longsword, crossbow, or wear real chain mail or plate mail. LOL
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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Pancho » Sunday December 1st, 2019 5:02am

Jalapenotrellis wrote:Really...wizard wearing Borin's armour (spelled the UK way), wielding Orc's Bane or the Spirit Blade? So basically the wizard could use a broadsword and a shortsword but not a longsword, crossbow, or wear real chain mail or plate mail. LOL

Yep, the Wizard could be 4/4 with his attack and defence dice by the end of the UK base game. It actually made the Wizard a fair character to play by the time we got to face Ogres and Wizards of Morcar. Of course, there was a better chance that one of the other Heroes would get to these weapons first, so he wouldn’t be quite 4/4. The US version seemed to go down the route of Wizards Cloaks and Bracers instead.

I don’t see a problem with it. These are magically tempered weapons that can be used by smaller guys. I hate to keep going back to LOTRs, but have you heard of Frodo and his Mithril suit or Gandalf and Glamdring?
Last edited by Pancho on Sunday December 1st, 2019 5:26am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Jalapenotrellis » Sunday December 1st, 2019 5:16am

I've watched all the LoTR movies but haven't read the books. I also understand battle mages (I have one on Divinity Original Sin 2 and in Skyrim), but the HeroQuest I have portrays the Wizard as the squishiest caster archetype as they get. I'm thinking fire mage from WoW or sorcerer from Aion. It is interesting seeing the differences among versions of this game. I think the shift to squishier was a good choice for HeroQuest, as it creates more differentiation among the classes.
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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby wallydubbs » Sunday December 1st, 2019 10:50am

Pancho wrote:The US version seemed to go down the route of Wizards Cloaks and Bracers instead.

Technically the US version doesn't have Bracers, so the Wizard's maximum attack is 2 Dice (Wizard's Staff) and 3 for Defense dice (Wizard's Cloak). I feel there's a lot more that could have been done with the Wizard. There are only 5 artifacts he can use and 2 of them credit his spell casting ability. But with so many expansion packs you'd think there'd be some artifacts that would buff him a bit more.
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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby lestodante » Sunday December 1st, 2019 5:09pm

Wizard with Borin's Armour, plus Bracers and Protective Cloak and Rock Skin...!!! YEAH!


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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Jalapenotrellis » Sunday December 1st, 2019 9:23pm

Wizard can always rock skin himself. Not like the other players benefit as much unless the wizard never takes a hit.
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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Kurgan » Friday February 5th, 2021 11:07am

While it has never come up yet in our gaming sessions, I would be inclined to allow a Hero with this magical sword to strike two adjacent Orcs OR the same Orc twice. It's a nice bonus as was said. A few lucky rolls will make you glad you kept it!

I can understand those GMs who decide to allow it to attack Goblins, because of the ambiguity in JRR Tolkien's lore about the relationship between Orcs and Goblins. This was probably brought to mind because the card shows the sword glowing, which calls to mind the small sword whom Bilbo Baggins named "Sting" which seems to be a clear inspiration. In the Hobbit they talked about Goblins, in Lord of the Rings they talk about Orcs (the books mind you, we're not talking about the movies where it seems like they are two different species of creature).

For me, I'm going to assume in the HQ world that they are different, and so only use it for Orcs, which let's face it, are a pretty common enemy encountered in HQ, and yes, after awhile it may seem like a weak weapon, but the "2 for 1 deal" would make it useful in a situation where a Battle Axe, would be less so (since you'd likely trounce one adjacent Orc but not the other).

PS: I"m playing with the NA rules, where the Wizard doesn't get to use it, but if I were using EU, I'd still allow the "2 for 1".


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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Davane » Friday February 5th, 2021 12:02pm

I use the literal interpretation of "versus Orcs." Thus, in order to get a second attack, you need to have attacked an Orc, and the second attack needs to be against an Orc. Although most Orcs have one body point, there's quite a few Orc GMCs that have more than two body points, so Orc's Bane is great against them. Plus, it's common to find Heroes holding choke points surrounded by Orcs - Orcs just aren't much of a threat if used in groups of 1, unless you can catch the Wizard off-guard...

As for Wizard's using artefacts, it's worth noting that in AHQ, Wizards can use Runeblades - a type of magical sword. It's also worth noting that Wizards in WHQ can also use Swords according to the artwork.

As such, I would totally let Wizards use magical swords that are no larger than Broadswords, allowing them to use Orc's Bane (a Shortsword) and Spirit Blade (Broadsword). If I were kind, I might even allow the Wizard to purchase a Shortsword (US version, no diagonal attack). This way, the Wizard has to use the Staff (1 :skull: attack) or Wizard's Staff (2 :skull: attack) if they want to use a diagonal attack.
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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Kurgan » Monday February 8th, 2021 7:09am

Yes, what of other types of "Orcs?" Folks have already debated over whether the Witch Lord is undead (for game mechanic purposes he isn't, and Holy Water, which brings up the whole issue, seems to indicate its talking about regular undead monsters, specifically named). :orc:

But the Orc Shaman Grawshawk in WOM, is an "Orc" and you could get the Orc's Bane bonus against him, correct? Same with any "special Orcs" throughout the quests. And for your homebrewers that are using Black Mountain (Dew?) Orcs (these guys are extreme!), I presume Orc's bane would come out of mothballs for these gnarly dudes too. |_P

I don't have a problem per se with the Wizard using other weapons, but I'm following a particular ruleset where he's very restricted, even if I'm really using a hybrid set that implements stuff from other versions too. So I've substituted limited use, expensive magical items (can you put a price on Artifacts? that was a cool thread too), and also implemented a kind of battle mage class character (the Mystic borrowed from Legacy of Sorasil) and I have an expanded armory. So my Wizard can use dagger, staff, whip, sling, torch (1 die each); or the Wizard's Staff (2 dice)... while the Mystic can use a Shortsword/Mace/Handaxe/hammer/Flail (2 dice), Broadsword/bastard sword (3 dice). To balance the two, while the Mystic seems more well rounded out of the gate, the Wizard has more variety in terms of magic, and his power potential ramps up much higher over time.

I figure anyone can use the Wizard's Staff, but only the Wizard can get the benefit of 2 dice with it (everyone else uses like a normal staff, 1 die... so give it to him!), and a Champion Wizard (3-5 quests completed) would get to use black dice with it (and a green die for the Wizard's cloak too). The Barbarian and Dwarf can use magic too, but they need to scrounge up Spell Scrolls for that... Getting way off topic, but just wanted to share!


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Re: A few questions on Orc's Bane

Postby Daedalus » Friday August 13th, 2021 6:16pm

wallydubbs wrote:Does Orc's Bane only let you attack the same Orc twice?

For instance: if the Dwarf wielding Orc's Bane is caught between 2 orcs, can he attack one, then the other?

I say the latter, a Hero can attack one, then a second Orc. Orc's Bane should benefit from versatility to keep it a relevant artifact, in my opinion.

wallydubbs wrote:What if he's caught between an orc and a goblin, can he attack the goblin and then attack twice if the 2nd attack is against the orc?

Suppose he's in a room full of orcs, can he attack-move-attack again?

I'd say no to house-ruling a Goblin/Orc combo, though I had considered it in light of the lower utility of Orc's Bane. Problem is, even if attacks against seperate Orcs is allowed, the opportunity seldom arises to pull it off, as Pancho noted earlier. To make Orc's Bane more useful, I instead allow attack/move/attack. See this post for.an explanation of why it works using the rules.

wallydubbs wrote:I don't suppose Heroic Brew will let him attack a 3rd or 4th time?

Nope to that. Neither Orc's Bane or Heroic Brew allow an extra.attack, which would stack. Instead, they specify attacking twice or two attacks, which are fixed amounts that don't combine.
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