Difficulty

[Infje]

Thank you!

[Infje]

So, last night went bad. I had a new player who constantly harassed me about the rules which was enough incentive for the others to join in. Needless to say, he won't be invited back. But the evening was ruined none the less.

I changed the subject of this thread since nobody in this helpful community seems to have problems with me asking my questions here. It avoids spamming you with new threads. As always I do my very best to find the answers using the search option. Most of the time this works, but not always. Back to yesterday:

We we're playing quest 6 of the main game. As soon as the heroes ventured out into the hall I started using the Chaos Knights without placing them on the board. This allowed me to ambush them. I only placed them on the board if they were in the line of sight. I take it that as a DM I'm free to move whatever monsters that are placed in the halls without informing the players. I only inform them as soon as they appear in the line of sight of the players. I don't see why I should leave them static, only to be triggered when the heroes see them. This caused them to accuse me of cheating and spawning enemies. What do the experts think/use? I feel that when monster is out of sight I'm free to remove them and spawn them were I see fit (while keeping it fair).

In quest 7, as soon as the monster in the northern hall was killed they searched for traps. That means for the entire hall. I think it's ludicrous that they can see that far ahead. I was thinking about only being able to search for a set number of squares. Only that would be difficult to keep track of. Any ideas?

We also used Wolf's Wizard system in which you roll 1D6 in order to keep spells (you have to roll the same number or less than the corresponding cards in the spell group) and this worked out great.

[knightkrawler]

We we're playing quest 6 of the main game. As soon as the heroes ventured out into the hall I started using the Chaos Knights without placing them on the board. This allowed me to ambush them. I only placed them on the board if they were in the line of sight. I take it that as a DM I'm free to move whatever monsters that are placed in the halls without informing the players. I only inform them as soon as they appear in the line of sight of the players. I don't see why I should leave them static, only to be triggered when the heroes see them. This caused them to accuse me of cheating and spawning enemies. What do the experts think/use? I feel that when monster is out of sight I'm free to remove them and spawn them were I see fit (while keeping it fair).

You're absolutely right. The quest map is for you to see and for your personal usage. Accusing you of cheating is ridiculous because the players can't and MUST NOT know the additional "rules", environments, and peculiarities the quest map equip you with. I see it that simple. A player harassing you because of "cheating"... well, HQ is not his game. Let him play Monopoly.
Because these players obviously don't see the point of playing HeroQuest and do not have the heart for it.

In quest 7, as soon as the monster in the northern hall was killed they searched for traps. That means for the entire hall. I think it's ludicrous that they can see that far ahead. I was thinking about only being able to search for a set number of squares. Only that would be difficult to keep track of. Any ideas?

The area is searched for traps according to line-of-sight.
My houserule is when a player searches for traps he finds all traps between the nearest corners he can see in two (or sometimes three) direction. To keep track I put a marker in that area that tells me it's been searched. It's easy and "realistic" and doesn't slow down the game much.

We also used Wolf's Wizard system in which you roll 1D6 in order to keep spells (you have to roll the same number or less than the corresponding cards in the spell group) and this worked out great.

I agree. For those who don't know what we're talking about: http://oldscratch.smackwell.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?num=1287927278
You have to read the entire thread. There are more than one useful idea, Wolf's is the best, but it's one of these brainstorm threads where everyone comes up with a flicker of greatness.
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Now, I'm sorry for the problems you have with your players. The solution would be simple: lay out to them the goal of game -> having fun
explain to them HQ's main props -> you can play cooperatively or you can slit each others' throats
explain to them the different roles of the Evil Wizard player and tell them how YOU would like to play him so that YOU are ALSO HAVING FUN
If they can't deal with this, well, then, as I said, HeroQuest is not their game. They should play Uno. There's no cheating in Uno. And no creativity.

[Infje]

Again, thank you for the quick and elaborate response. What if there is more than one trap? Do you allow them to find everything, within the line of sight, in one search?

[knightkrawler]

Yes. It's in the rules. But I cut down the search area as described.
There is one quest where a hero can only ever find the nearest trap per search. You COULD make this your general rule, but it greatly slows down the game.

[chaoticprime]

The way the rulebook tells you to describe traps found by searching is hardly in-depth. I'm paraphrasing, but, "the ceiling looks unsafe," is it. I don't find it ludicrous at all for Heroes to be able to spot something like that from a maximum possible distance of approximately 120 feet.

Also, the reason monsters do not normally move around the board unseen by the Heroes, is that they are not permitted in the rules to open doors.

The game was very clearly not designed with realism in mind. The game aggregates and assesses all qualities of living human-beings in five numbers.

You are a player trying to win. If you cannot win, you do not need to change the rules so you can. You need to learn to play better. How often do you see home rules that radically alter the player motif? Rarely ever, if compared to how often you see home rules widening the power of the Evil Wizard player.

The Quests, by their own immanence, are not enough to beat the Heroes. If each Quest map is like an uncut puzzle, it is up to you break it up into puzzle pieces for the Heroes to assemble. The quantity and complexity of these is all on you the Evil Wizard player to design.

I agree that there are modes of play that are too abstract, but Heroquest is not Dungeons & Dragons, and you are not a DM. It is not your responsibility to parrot the rules to the Hero players, only to let them know when they break them. Every time you give a player a suggestion--one that is not a lie (side-note: lie constantly), you are giving up a little bit of your game. The players are scum. They only want gratification that comes with loot and slaughter and winning the day. You eat Heroes. That's what you do--that's all you do. Good players rise to the occasion and become great ones. Bad players quit your game and go play Pathfinder with all the other insecure jack-offs.

Helpful Advice:

> Don't give helpful advice to Hero players. They're there to be killed--they should choose to let that be entertaining.
> Goblins, whenever possible, run away. Position them directly behind traps--pit traps work best. A Barbarian in a pit trap is one-die less formidable.
> Whenever a Hero opens a door and stops, do not bottleneck the doorway like an assembly line of stupid unless the rocket scientist blocking the doorway has a crossbow--in which case, do attack because he can't shoot through or around a monster, and his allies can't shoot through him.
> Focus monster attacks on the Hero who has the least remaining Body Points.
> Keep track of Heroes that have healing potions. For all intents and purposes, potions are nothing more than surplus Body Points. A Barbarian with four Body Points would be generally easier to kill than a Wizard with four Body Points and a healing potion. Remember that Heroes cannot use potions on other Heroes if either of them are adjacent to a monster.
> Whenever possible cut-off Heroes that are in rooms ahead of the others. Block the door with the weakest available monster. Its a tactic that guarantees the Heroes will focus their attacks away from your heavier-hitters for at least one of their turns.
> Position monsters in rooms to fight in staggered formation--monsters needn't ever be positioned orthogonally from another monster.
> Monsters revealed in hallways are too rare to waste by just having them run to the Heroes. Turn them around and lead the Heroes to where you want them to be.
> Use weaker monster as shields to ward off ranged attacks directed at your heavier hitting monsters.
> Try to rout Heroes whenever you can. If you kill one and cause the others to flee, you just scored yourself a pile of stolen Hero equipment.
> Get the Talisman of Lore out of the game as soon as you can kill the Barbarian holding it. That one little Mind Point makes a 16% difference when resisting Fear and Command Chaos Spells.
> Read the Quests thoroughly before you begin a game, and put a plan together in your head for how you want to execute the Heroes. There are particular Quests in which I almost always kill at least one Hero.
> Whenever you kill a Hero, describe the death colorfully. There's wonder in dying hilariously.

[knightkrawler]

Word.

[Goblin-King]

I wouldn't normally allow for "unactivated" monsters to move around unseen.
The reason is mostly that it does in fact give an opportunity for cheating (even if you don't). You can basically warp monsters around and just say you moved them slowly during the last ten rounds. The players have no way of knowing.
I personally don't think you are supposed to stealth-move models. It seems most logical that you only use things that are on the board. Don't think it's specified in the rules though.

As for trap-searching-distance. It's only really ever an issue in the 4 long edge-corridors.
And yeah, the heroes might discover a trap aaaaaall the way across the board, but guess what? Now they have to remember where it was or keep searching to be reminded.
I think it works out fine the way it is.
Our group at least has never had any issues with searching being too OP.

[Sjeng]

the heroes might discover a trap aaaaaall the way across the board, but guess what? Now they have to remember where it was or keep searching to be reminded.

Why? once found, it's found. It's either placed on the board or triggered and spent.

[Goblin-King]

Really? You sure?

We've always played that pits only open if someone actually step on it.
And why would spear traps be deactivated just because you spot it? That also highly devalues the dwarf/toolkit.
And you cant make spear trap mazes?

And it kinda fixes the problem with being able to search too big an area.

sadface!

Gotta look that up later...