First and second edition differences in the UK rules

[j_dean80]

No one caught that Treasure Hoard is misspelled?

[lestodante]

Curious... this is probably the same reason for what I often see on ebay auctions for "Against the Ogre Hoard" (instead of Horde)!

[Okko]

Looking at the 2 sets of cards I have from the first edition ( marked 4271 GB 3 89) they both show the short sword can be used diagonally. Must have been corrected before the issue of the second edition.

[HispaZargon]

Another difference not mentioned before on this thread can be found on page 15 of the Rulebook: In UK 1st Edition, once a Hero becomes a Champion, the Emperor also gives him 500 gold coins, however the in UK 2nd Edition the Hero is not gold rewarded for it.

Questbook maps also have some differences in shadowed areas on pages 6, 10 and 30. About differences on page 10, I think 1st edition map layout is the more correct one, it makes more sense for me, but who knows why MB changed it for 2nd edition.

Map on page 14 of Questbook 1st Edition has also some mistakes: Mark B is not shown in the map, nor Grak location.

Here are my 2 cents.

[Kurgan]

Looking at the 2 sets of cards I have from the first edition ( marked 4271 GB 3 89) they both show the short sword can be used diagonally. Must have been corrected before the issue of the second edition.

It's not an error. The shortsword's diagonal ability was removed in the NA (and remake which is based upon it) rules in 1990. Notice that the Spear was also removed and the Longsword added as the main diagonal attack weapon (with the Staff and Wizard's Staff artifact for the Wizard).

I used to think of the EU and NA editions as a linear upgrade or revision, when in reality they are like two separate games, much like how the Japanese edition is its own thing. Many similarities yes (and using most of the same assets), but also important differences at nearly every level.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

Ordinary set! You can recognize the 2 versions by the box too: the first edition is showing in the top/left corner (under MB logo) "9-adult" while the second edition says "10-adult".
The Advanced Quest edition have the same cards of the second edition, just some minor differences on the Heroes card (text is in a different position).
As for the questbook, you can see from the back cover wich version it is: 4271GB489 or 4271GB490. Each part of the code identifies product (first four digits), country (the two letters) and release date (last 3 digits), so if you decompose the code 4271GB489, you have to read:
4271(product, Heroquest base set) GB (country, Great Britain version) 4 (month, april) 89 (year, 1989).
There are codes on several pieces, box, questbook, instruction manual, tiles sheet, cards. Every correction or update they did, resulted in a new code.

This is interesting...

I have, own or have seen with my own eyes the following codes:

• 4271GB489 on Quest Book (copyright 1989) has The Maze so "First Edition"
• 4271GB489 on Rules of Play - "First Edition" (copyright 1989) - incidentally this has the text "HeroQuest is a trademark owned by Games Workshop Ltd. Used with permission." which I hadn't noticed before and is interesting, particularly as elsewhere in the text it uses "Hero Quest" with a space, but not relevant to this topic
• 4271GB889 on Rules of Play also First Edition, I’m going to double check the differences between these two!
• 4271GB889 on First Edition box
• 4271GB389 on First Edition Character Sheet
• 4271GB790 on Rules of Play - "Second Edition"
• 4271GB490 on Quest Book - "Second Edition" (with Trial)
• 4271GB389 on Character Sheets ("Second Edition") - indicates these are early printings March 89 so 1st and 2nd edition character sheets are the same.
• 4271ML489 on bottom corner of the gameboard (copyright 1989) so presumably same board for First and Second Edition?
• 4271GB490 inside of box cover ("Second Edition")
• 427102 outside of box 1989 copyright (this same product code appears on both First and Second Edition boxes even though the boxes are different)
• 4971GB690 on a Character Sheet published with the Adventure Design Booklet
• 4971ML790 on a Sticker Sheet published with the Adventure Design Booklet (copyright 1990)
• 4971GB491 on Adventure Design Booklet (copyright 1990)

The original version I believe was released in the "late summer" of 1989 (estimated dates range from August to October, but it was definitely out by Xmas as I had it in my eager paws at that point) so assuming the prints were done some time prior to release then the "489" being April 1989 seems reasonable

The second edition came out in 1990, not sure what month but a "print date" of "790" being July 1990 seems plausible

The Adventure Design Kit seems a little odd though with "prints" indicate June and July 1990 for some parts and April 1991 for the booklet which suggests it was developed over a longer period which seems fine, but if the booklet was printed in April 1991 then presumably the whole thing was published after that date, so why the copyright of 1990 on the booklet, maybe this just reflects an aborted attempt to publish earlier, it certainly appears that Second Edition and Design Kit material may have been worked on over the same period, perhaps a decision to not include some stuff in SE, but then release it separately at a later date?

"ML" on the sticker sheet threw me for a moment, "ML" country code being Mali seemed an odd choice, but then I realised that it isn't the country code as such but the language "GB" being en_GB so presumably the sticker sheet having no words on it would presumably make "ML" multi - language or something similar (I later noticed the other "ML" on the code on the gameboard with is also language-less so this seems likely...)

[Bareheaded Warrior]

It appears that there may have been more than one version of the First Edition. I recently came across a first edition partial set that includes a "rules of play" booklet marked with the number 4271GB889 rather than the one I previously owned 4271GB489 (which is the same version as the scan on the Inn)

Differences between 4271GB489 (Apr 89) and 4271GB889 (Aug 89)

4 pit trap tiles increased to 6 pit trap tiles

The "TM" on the front cover under the HeroQuest title, the "HeroQuest is a trademark owned by Games Workshop Ltd. Used with permission" on the bottom of p3 and the same on the back cover have all been removed from the 889 version

Secret Doors and Traps p12 has an additional piece of text added "Secret doors may be found by searching on either side of the wall in which they are placed"

Wandering Monster p13 has an additional piece of text added "If there is no vacant space adjacent to the character who drew the card, the evil wizard player may place the wandering monster in any vacant square in the same room or passage. He may not, however, attack another character." which feels like feedback incorporated from a round of playtesting to me.

On p14 and p15 the references to "bold text" in the Quest book have been replaced with references to "parchment text" in the Quest book, which suggests some changes were made to the Quest book...

Also on p16 under Completing a Quest has an additional piece of text added "Furthermore, players may escape the dungeon by landing on the stair tile. Monsters may never land on it."

Whilst I'm speculating here, this may resolve some of the conversations around Shortsword diagonal attacks

the short sword can be used diagonally in the 2nd edition but is really useless in its 1st version (probably a mistake).

That's not right. I had the 1st edition and the short sword could attack diagonally (short sword, staff and spear could, spear and hand axe could be thrown).

Looking at the 2 sets of cards I have from the first edition ( marked 4271 GB 3 89) they both show the short sword can be used diagonally. Must have been corrected before the issue of the second edition.

But unless I'm missing something obvious I don't think I've ever seen cards marked with the product codes...but maybe the first-first edition "489" had the shortsword without its diagonal ability...and the second-first edition "889" corrected that error? (and it is an error under EA rules as no one would ever spend 150gc on a weapon that gives you 2AD when everyone already has at least 2AD even when unarmed in EA edition except the Wizard and he cannot use this card)

Quick everyone, dig out your own copies and start searching for product codes!

[Kurgan]

Great work you sleuths!

Of course if you buy a set off ebay or whatever, sometimes it is because someone has mixed and matched parts. For instance I purchased KK & ROTWL used some time ago and the cut up cards (this being the NA editions) were in the wrong distributions. One of the spell scrolls was repeated from one box to the other (so I was technically missing one of the original ones). Sadly I misplaced one of the replacement cards.

Occasionally you'll luck out in the other direction and get an extra piece or two that wasn't part of the original (already complete) set!

My '89 box says 4271 02 (inside lid says 4271 889) and includes a diagonal striking Shortsword in the equipment deck.

I have a monster card (goblin) inside the box that says 4271 GB 389.
4217 1ML 489 on the board (1989 copyright date). If any of those details help at all...

This set I got from a guy on BGG, but he also threw in his WOM and ATOH with the sale that he'd owned from childhood (but those expansions were missing their boxes).


Interesting to see another variant then of the non-diagonal shortsword (I see the screenshots)... makes perfect sense that it would be an error. You don't even get the option to sell back Equipment in the EU rules (which helps explain the otherwise "useless" shortsword NA armory entry).

My '89 rules of play (4271GB889) matches your text, BHW.

[lestodante]

There are only two versions of card decks in UK: 4271GB389 (first release, March 1989) and 4271GB490 (second release, April 1990) although there are some 1990 decks featuring the old Short Sword. They updated only this card without applying a new code. HQ Advanced Quest (the one featring The Dark Company) is using the same cards of 1990.
Tiles with no text such as the Witch Lord and Kellar's Keep tiles are showing ML (Mid Land maybe? No, Multi Language I guess is more appropriate) in the codes for the country.
The boxes feature only the main product code (4271 for example) and the country is indicated with a two digits number: 00 Germany, 01 France, 02 Great Britain, 03 Italy and so on.
For example the French box will have the code 4271 01 on the sides, the Italian box 4271 03.
The most ancient questbook I had was dated 4-89 and was featuring the GW trademark on the rear and inside. It was featuring a different paper and was slightly smaller in size. I sold it during past years to a Canadian collector (drathe maybe?) but I saved some photos.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

There are only two versions of card decks in UK: 4271GB389 (first release, March 1989) and 4271GB490 (second release, April 1990) although there are some 1990 decks featuring the old Short Sword. They updated only this card without applying a new code. HQ Advanced Quest (the one featring The Dark Company) is using the same cards of 1990.
Tiles with no text such as the Witch Lord and Kellar's Keep tiles are showing ML (Mid Land maybe? No, Multi Language I guess is more appropriate) in the codes for the country.
The boxes feature only the main product code (4271 for example) and the country is indicated with a two digits number: 00 Germany, 01 France, 02 Great Britain, 03 Italy and so on.
For example the French box will have the code 4271 01 on the sides, the Italian box 4271 03.
The most ancient questbook I had was dated 4-89 and was featuring the GW trademark on the rear and inside. It was featuring a different paper and was slightly smaller in size. I sold it during past years to a Canadian collector (drathe maybe?) but I saved some photos.

I guess for me the take-away in all this is just to watch your version numbers! I had always assumed one set of rules for First Edition, one set for Second Edition, but it appears that it isn't quite so straightforward. That said the differences in terms of rules between 489 and 889 aren't really significant in terms of gameplay, they are just the kind of tweaks that you expect from play testing, where a situation crops up that isn't covered by the rules so a tweak is applied to cover it and the rulebook updated.

Solely from a curiosity point of view, the following points are of interest to me, but I don't think they make any differences to the rules themselves.

Trademark

Trademark removal is interesting, 4271GB489 seems to go out of its way to ensure the reader is made aware that GW hold the trademark for "HeroQuest" but all that is removed in 4271GB889 and isn't present in Second Edition (4271GB790 just to be on the safe side!) and yet Advanced HeroQuest rulebook does mention that HeroQuest is a GW trademark, so why remove it from the later 2 versions?

Box Country Code
Thanks for the update around the 4271 01 part of the code, but it might be good to confirm whether this is truly country of release rather than language of release, perhaps Canadian, Australian, New Zealandian sources can confirm as I believe those would be a different country of release but still the same language?

Non-diagonal Shortsword

Accepting that there were only two "versions" of the cards, I'm still a little confused around the "non-diagonal" shortsword version, was this an error within some printing of the first edition 4271GB389 that was later corrected in the first edition (but without a version code update), or was this an error within some printing of the second edition 4271GB490 that was later corrected in the second edition (but without a version code update), it seems unlikely but not impossible that it was both. I feel like it was a second edition error that was later corrected but that is a gut feeling rather than evidence based. My guess is that they cut that piece of text by accident when updating from 4271GB389 to 4271GB490.

A similar example of this kind of omission would be that the 4271GB389 "gold" treasure cards state that they get returned to the deck (so you have to make a note of the gold value on the back of your character sheet), whereas 4271GB490 "gold" treasure cards are not returned to the deck but are retained by the player, but they still state that you need to record the gold value on the back of your character sheet, even though you don't as you keep the card, so that piece of text could have been removed but wasn't.