HEROQUEST - COMPANION APP discussion

[SirRick]

Today I played Quest 9: The Sound of the Hearthkin Horn. Once again there are some nuances left out in the app version of the story. When you read the story in the book, you experience an “Ah!” moment. Also when Mentor mentions previously that he will give you the signal to use the Hearthkin Horn, this story is your only hint.

The quest was fairly pleasant to play through. Because of the advice Mentor gives you, each battle you catch the enemy with their pants around their ankles. The battles do get tougher as you go, but nothing special.

Despite the title of the quest, and Mentor’s “signal”, I completely forgot to use the Hearthkin Horn. I got by fine without it, but you do get a nice bonus if you do happen to use it at the proper time. The artwork in the app for Abraxus is one of my favorites I have see so far

I did pretty well searching for treasure in this quest, and by the time I reached the solitary cupboard room, I knew what was in store for me. The cupboard did not disappoint. Inside there lurked a Dread Warrior and a hazard, continuing my streak of always drawing 2 bad cards from the Sly Storage feature.

*edit*: I forgot to mention this quest uses more secret door tiles than there are in the game.

[SirRick]

This morning I completed that last quest of FL. It was short and sweet with one of the more epic final boss fights I have encountered. There is an awesome mechanic introduced that gives the enemy a chance to counter attack. The quest notes say every time a hero makes an attack or casts a spell on Qwindrak, he makes this attack. The app does not utilize this properly. The problem is in the app, there is no way to claim you are initiating an attack. Instead the app only triggers this attack if you deal damage to Qwindrak or successfully cast a spell on him. In this situation if your attack misses, you do not get smacked with a counter attack. This could be improvised yourself if you knew about this mechanic beforehand, but since I don’t look over the quest until I finish it. There was no way to know.

There is not much to explore in this quest, but there are two small hidden rooms. In one of these rooms I was finally able to overcome my greatest enemy….the cupboard. When I searched for treasure I got a wandering monster, and a bag of 25 gold coins! Finally, after all this time I finally got a good card from the Sly Storage feature. I was happy but almost disappointed my bad streak finally ended. It is fitting though in the last quest I defeated Qwindrak and his accursed cupboard. Mentor should have said I defeated two enemies this day, not just one. After finishing the quest, you finally understand why the quest pack is called First Light.

The conclusion in the app features all of the epilogue text. You hear two distinct voices (but both the same voice actor I think). One voice describes the scene before you and the other is Mentor speaking directly to you and the other “warriors”. Are these the other heroes perhaps? Mentor proceeds to unleash a stream of bad news (the events of the GS epilogue) as well as more bad news, that neatly ties everything in FL with all the other events happening. Very cool!

Now these new base heroes will join my gang of other heroes I assembled previously from all the other quests. I thought it best to play FL after MotM as a sort of flashback because of a particular character involved who makes an appearance in RotDM.

So next I will start RotDM. I am excited for it. I settled on a party of the Elf (the one I used in GS and MotM), along with the Rogue, Knight, and maybe I’ll throw in the Berserker for the first time. If not I will mix in one of the FL heroes instead.

[Kurgan]

*edit*: I forgot to mention this quest uses more secret door tiles than there are in the game.

Good call, one more than are in the box!

[Aki]

I started JoD and the mechanic of replicants, when they are attached to a hero, is very frustrating.
Every time a hero ends his turn, the mechanic is activated, even if it is not the hero with the replicant attached, so you lose 1BP and check if the hero is immobilized for every single replicant

[TheLastChaosWarrior]

I started JoD and the mechanic of replicants, when they are attached to a hero, is very frustrating.
Every time a hero ends his turn, the mechanic is activated, even if it is not the hero with the replicant attached, so you lose 1BP and check if the hero is immobilized for every single replicant

You mean spawnlings?

[Kurgan]

Sounds very sci-fi, I might have to add something like that for Space Crusade...!

I started JoD and the mechanic of replicants, when they are attached to a hero, is very frustrating.
Every time a hero ends his turn, the mechanic is activated, even if it is not the hero with the replicant attached, so you lose 1BP and check if the hero is immobilized for every single replicant

The mama monster spawns a little monster OR moves all the spawnlings after EACH hero turn, this is correct. At the end of the attached hero's turn, if there's a spawnling (or more) on him, he takes the damage AND gets envenomed. They're no joke! That's why the heroes have to work together to get them off... or else you better stock a lot of potions!

[Aki]

I started JoD and the mechanic of replicants, when they are attached to a hero, is very frustrating.
Every time a hero ends his turn, the mechanic is activated, even if it is not the hero with the replicant attached, so you lose 1BP and check if the hero is immobilized for every single replicant

You mean spawnlings?

Yes, sorry

[manamail]

Hi. I have a question. I'm playing HQ with the app and we're on mission 12 of the core book, and it's been a walk in the park. To increase the difficulty, I'm thinking of adding more difficulty in the app options. I've set advanced goblins and advanced skeletons, and my question is whether to add +1 attack die or +1 defense die. For more experienced players, which of the two options is more difficult? I think +1 defense die would make the monsters last a little longer, but it's really only a 1/6 chance of survival, and +1 attack die would make more of a difference... as long as the monsters survive the first turn, because normally when we open a room we rush in and no one usually survives. Which of the two options would you recommend to increase the difficulty? And finally, the +1 body points option for monsters. Do you think it's too difficult? Has anyone tried it? Thank you very much. Best regards.

[TheLastChaosWarrior]

The app is always a lot easier than playing a human EW, as the computer doesn't use monsters logically or attack properly.
It frequently attacks with a monster next to a Hero, but then fails to move away, meaning he can't then move another monster in to attack.
To compensate increase monster body points by 2 or 3, or try playing with weak Heros like Rogue and Druid.
Also, you don't have to use 4 Heros, I have played before with just 2.

[Kurgan]

The fact that so much is left to the "honor system" for the app makes it a little more flexible than one might first imagine. I love the fact that in theory, a person who owned the 1990 NA set of HeroQuest could download the App and pretty much play it as is (at least for the sets/expansions they owned, and even some they never did, like Prophecy of Telor & Spirit Queen's Torment and a few of the Pulse quests that used the same base assets as well as just over half of the First Light quests). In the case of those other sets (besides the GS) you'd only have to simulate a few assets. Fortune's Longsword is a once per quest re-roll of 1 combat die. Ring of Fortitude is just a Talisman of Lore (but for a BP instead of a MP). Rod of Telekinesis is like a Tempest Spell scroll that the monster can roll for a spell break against (5 or 6 on a red die) that renews itself each quest. Phantom Blade is just a (non-throwable) dagger that once per quest has an unblockable hit.


The app tells you to do something, and you can just ignore it, in favor of the actual rules you're using (you can "fudge" a bad call by the app as well, or work around a glitch). Also, the app might not have a prompt but you can still do the thing with your party on the physical board. The game calls for a card draw? Just do it. The game calls for someone's turn to be skipped? Just do it. If you need an extra monster on the board, unfortunately the only way to do that is to have a hero move into an unsearched room and search for a wandering monster (whatever it is on that quest... you can't modify monster stats on the fly unfortunately, except their mind points which have no effect if I recall correctly)... of course you can just do all that on the physical board, but the app will just have to wait until that fight has been resolved since there's "nothing" on its own screen.

Earlier versions of the app did show more card text images and descriptions (for spells, artifacts, etc) than the latest versions. For example the cards for the unique spells of the formerly exclusive "mythic" heroes were entirely within the app. I thought this was cool because at first only the few Mythic owners could use them, but at least it made it easier to write down and proxy these heroes if you weren't so lucky. Now that all of these heroes have appeared in some other form in retail, you just have to track those down for the (majority) of the spells that aren't shown within the app ("Follow the card's instructions"). On the other hand the App has added new items (for Equipment, Treasure, Artifacts, even Alchemy) that can be used anywhere rather than just inside the expansion(s) in which they appeared (the Hearthkin Horn is hidden away under "artifacts" even though it had no physical card, to access outside of "First Light" by the way!).

I've already speculated on ways to use the official Companion App with a 2nd ed. (1990) EU set:

-no "the maze" (1st edition) but you could simply not use Treasure Search function except in rooms with treasure chests or the weapons rack for the first hero.
-I suppose while you'd miss the maze, you could skip to quest 2 (roll off to see you gets the 100 gold reward of the 1st quest) and just draw a treasure card in corridors. use the 1st edition deck if playing 1st edition (1989) of course. the quest layouts won't be identical to the booklet, but pretty close.
-using pass through rock scroll to bypass fallen block traps you would have disarmed after the fact... and potion of airwalk for disarmed after the fact pit traps
-you can kill abominations (simulated fimir), dread (chaos) warrior, mummy, gargoyle (and most boss/named enemies from core system, ROTWL/KK) after 1 BP of damage
-only use the spells according to what it says on the card (honor system with the app functions).
-Ignore any "artifacts" you wouldn't normally get, adjust the stats for equipment and spells according to your knowledge of the different rules.
-changes to the quests themselves can't be helped but you could rationalize it like you're replaying a quest that "Morcar" has remixed for you. (Morcar = Zargon!)
-No way to play Wizards of Morcar quests (yet! but someday...)
-Equipment that isn't part of the remake series can be easily simulated since attacks from weapons are handled by the heroes and their dice rolls anyway (spear) and armor is handled by defense rolls anyway outside the app (Cloak of Protection).
-The app doesn't care what Treasure deck you are using, so just draw the cards according to what you have.

For the Japanese edition (that is, that 1991 physical set being used with the App) it would require a lot more work to simulate everything but really the assets mostly have their equivalents within the App's Game System. You'd be playing (mostly) the "wrong quests" though so it would be more like playing the American quests with a different ruleset. Ignore assets that have no equivalent within your rules/assets I guess, unless absolutely essential to accomplish the mission! Thankfully some of the biggest differences take place early on using alternate spells that had no cards anyway... or involve shopping with limited cards and gambling with gold between quests. The rest can be simulated similarly to simulating play of the EU edition within the App.


I also suggested if you wanted to use "mercenaries" in quests where the App doesn't normally allow it, or even a "fifth hero" situation you could simulate it by:
-Using the Fangwarden Amulet (and then altering the stats of the Raptor) or Hearthkin Horn (then modify stats of skeleton(s)) only problem is they can't use gear (you'd have to simulate it all). In quests where mercenaries are allowed, you could "hire" a mercenary and then pretend it's an additional hero by changing stats (use scout since he can search for & disarm traps but the rest of the functions you'd have to make up, because the app doesn't let him use any gear)


But here's another interesting thing you could do... what if you want to go beyond the rules and have more than one of the same type of character for your hero party. So let's say you want to use two Barbarians... like a male and female barbarian in the same party. Here you can rely on the honor system. If you sub in another hero for the one you want... you rename them and adjust their stats to what they should be (and in many cases you can pick the male/female version to more closely match the miniatures you're using). Once again you can't use a 5th hero (unless you proxy them with a mercenary if allowed, or else substitute a Raptor with the Fangwarden Amulet or Hearthkin skeleton with the Horn of the same name).

The Game System comes with the four heroes yes... but if you owned First Light you have an alternate of each of those four heroes (2 of each!). If you own the Haslab HeroQuest (Heroic or Mythic tier) you have a second set of heroes with the sex swapped versions. If you have the Mythic set you have a total of 3 wizards (two male, one female), four if you have First Light as well. Frozen Horror comes with a second Barbarian (female), while Mage of the Mirror comes with a second Elf (male). The Guardian Knight hero collection has male and female knights (a "third" knight comes with Rise of the Dread Moon with the visor down so you can imagine whatever you want though this version of the knight isn't recognized in the App yet). Monk and Rogue collections have two of each hero in them. Two versions of the Berserker and the Explorer appear in Jungles of Delthrak. One version of the Druid appears in the Mythic tier, but two other versions of the Druid appear in Against the Ogre Horde remake.

I admit that because of the spell/style cards, it's going to be tricky to have more than two Wizards (or two monks), but more than one Elf is much easier to simulate. Not everyone is going to have the Mythic set of course or be willing to purchase multiple sets (or print out extra cards). But you can simulate everything else with pieces of paper & pencil and working around the App's limitations.

The "melee" type heroes are fairly easy to simulate. A Barbarian and Dwarf are basically the same (just ignore the Dwarf's superior trap disarming ability if he's playing a Barbarian). The Berserker is a perfect match for the Barbarian since none of his abilities are enforced (just don't use his skills).

The Explorer and Rogue aren't the best choices because although their profiles look great as subs for the Dwarf and Elf, their skills pop up automatically (and in the case of the Explorer, ruin the surprise of at least one adjacent trap per turn). Everything else can be simulated on your end.

Actually the Monk, Druid, Warlock, and Bard make great subs. If they are standing in for another "melee" type hero (adjust their stats and name) and then just don't use their Style/Spell abilities at all, and then ignore their limitations that conflict with the character they are proxying.

When it comes to the Elf or Wizard, this is great, because for the #2 (or #3) Elf you can use any of the above heroes, but actually once again ANY hero will suffice. Now it's true that the App knows which hero is "The Elf" and only that Elf gets access to the "ELF SPELLS" but normally that's already a limitation (you'd need the honor system to bypass that and let a second Elf use another 3 spells from that group at the same time).

Certain items are allowed to be used by THE ELF alone (will say "no line of sight" if you try to use them with another hero).
Eleven Cloak of Passage : use "Pass Through Rock" spell scroll instead.
Ancient Staff: Simulate the spell effect against each of the monsters in the room using appropriate spell scrolls or just add damage in case of a lightning bolt for example.
Potion of Vision: This one unfortunately can't be fully simulated (since you can only search for traps/secret doors if no monsters are in sight).
On the other hand you can kind of deal with this by just saying a sprung trap didn't happen... ignore the effect (using Pass Through Rock to bypass an unavoidable falling block trap after resolving any attempts to disarm it if that were possible; using Potion of Airwalk that is "Use Treasure" to bypass a Pit Trap assuming it wouldn't have been disarmed). Since the Explorer's "Trap sense" can't be toggled this seems like a fair solution to me.

Instead of worrying about casting spells that match that hero, just "Use Special" and you can simulate everything you need:

Not all the "castor" types are the same. These magical or quasi-magical characters aren't all a perfect sub for the Elf or vice versa. Yes, they basically are just a melee type with different stats and a different set of skills/spells/styles. But an owner of ATOH remake will only have one set of Druid cards and the App doesn't simulate those Druid spells easily with the "Use Special" menu, so you may have to keep track of things yourself.

On the other hand, the healing abilities of the Bard and Druid are no different than simulating other types of healing. Same with any armor/attack type buff (Druid's Shapeshift, Bard's Inspiring Tale). The Bard's "Lullaby" is identical to water spell "Sleep" anyway. Druid's "Pixie" can be simulated by using two actions (search for traps, search for secret doors) though you'd have to fudge it a little (for a location with monsters present, see the Potion of Vision work around).

Warlock's "Fear" spell takes some imagination to simulate. You'd only count one attack die from the monster and remember to have to roll the "spell break" on a future turn for each of the monster's mind points. For fairness you could just count the highest attack die I suppose. Dark Wings card description isn't in the app so you'd just simulate that one anyway. DemonForm is a similar type of simulation to the Shapeshift of the Druid, the card text doesn't appear in the app so just follow the instructions. While it's kind of a fun thing to use another red figure to represent the "Demonform" of the Warlock or the "Shapeshift" of the Druid, these aren't strictly necessary, but if you have a spare animal companion (from ATOH remake, JoD, or the red Gargoyle from PoT retail) you can use those. Or here is place to use one of the "mystery tiles" ("mentor's seal" from remake GS, "bone pile" from ROTWL remake, or "mummy statue" from KK remake; or even one of those lesser used tiles from another expansion like the key from Frozen Horror or the Lunarium/Moonsilver flask from Mage of the Mirror).

Artifacts for Spells:

Earth:
"Heal Body" isn't in the app. You just do that yourself. (update stats to reflect the healing)
"Rock Skin" isn't in the app. Do it yourself.
Pass Through Rock (Spell Scroll of the same name)

Water:
"Water of Healing" isn't in the app. see "Heal Body" above.
Veil of Mist isn't in the app, substitute "Dust of Disappearance" artifact.
Sleep (Spell Scroll of the same name).

Air:
Tempest (Spell Scroll of the same name).
Swift Wind (isn't in the app, just move the right number of squares after you roll on the board).
Genie (Spell Scroll of the same name).

Fire:
Courage (isn't in the app, just handle it yourself... nice way to allow the various interpretations of the spell too!)
Ball of Flame (Spell Scroll of the same name)
Fire of Wrath (Spell Scroll of the same name)

Using two monks at once could get a little tricky. Yes, you can easily simulate them with any of the above heroes for the second monk, but you'd have to keep track of what styles they have used (to unlock fire) simultaneously. I suppose if you had any elemental spells that weren't being used in the party, you could flip one of those cards from each element over to represent that type (a fire card for fire, air for air, etc) assuming you don't also have an Elf or Wizard with you using those same spells (if you have the Game System AND first light you'd have two sets of such spells so you won't run out; this would also help if you have two elves, two wizards).

The App doesn't show the Monk's cards at all (just like it doesn't show the Berserker, Knight, Rogue or Explorer skill cards, though in the case of the latter three there are prompts that pop up when one of their abilities would have been used and only the Explorer "forces" you to use the Trap sensing ability) so you're simulating them with the cards anyhow.

Three Wizards in a party would get tricky since without buying extra sets you'd only have enough spells between the GS and FL to outfit two of them, the third you'd just have to keep track of it on paper or something (unless you owned Wizards of Morcar from the classic era since the remake version isn't out yet... so you'd be giving some of those extra spell sets to the Elf and/or Wizard). Or just keep track of it with pencil & paper.

Another goofy idea... if you don't have enough cards at your table (or don't like forcing someone to just write it all down or use slips of paper to stand in for cards), you could get a regular Deck of 52 standard playing cards and use those. There are many ways you could simulate stuff. You've got four suits (hearts, diamonds, clubs, spades) and within those you have the various face cards (king, queen, jack) that could represent various things. So you could have Hearts for fire spells there, or clubs for Earth, something along those lines. Or aces, or numbers, whatever works best to help you remember what is what which could also work for the Monk's styles or the spells of one of the other castor types (Druid, Bard, Warlock, etc).

Anything else I missed?