Another crossbow thread

[Lemmeron]

OK so let me try to explain it all.

Here is an example of a finished character card.


1. all characters have a single die for attack and a single die for defense written on their character card. Their mind + body points = 12 they may have symbols to help denote weapon / armour restrictions
2. almost all weapons +x dice to that base ATTACK character die (and armour and shields + to base DEFENSE die)
3. all cards are classified on the bottom by the type of card they are. Weapon, armor, helmet, shield, reload card, equipment, x element spell, mastery spell, spell scroll, potion etc etc
4. all cards will have a symbol matching those found on the character sheet for those who can use a weapon, or a red circle and a line through that symbol if they CAN'T use it (no symbols = no restrictions to who can use it).
ie you have to have the symbol on the card on your character card. OR not have it if it is struck out on the equipment card. (the symbols on the card above mean the amazon is the female version of the original barbarian AND is classified as a warrior - so she could use the heavy crossbow found on the previous page, where as an Elf could not due to it having the crossed swords symbol on the card denoting warriors only)

ok so we have the following dice - (The blue are used by monsters for 3-4 player game)


so of the above dice....
Barbarian rolls 1 black for attack and defense (so barb is very good for attack and not so good for defense)
Dwarf Rolls 1 white for attack and defense (dwarf is hero quest standard for both attack and defense)
Elf rolls 1 Green for attack and defense (Elf is weak at attack but good at defense)
Wizard rolls 1 Green for attack and 1 black for defense (making it weak at both attack and defense) until it is able to get magic gear and then rolls 1 purple for attack and defense (which helps address the weakness in the original game of wizards in combat)

A crossbow is +1 White OR +1 Black for Dwarf
so the attack with crossbow for each character would be this..
Barbarian 1 Black (base) + 1 White (crossbow)
Dwarf 1 white (base) + 1 Black (crossbow)
Elf 1 Green (base) + 1 White (crossbow)
Wizard cant use it.

The idea of the symbols is basically you stick the dice shown in the symbols on the card. The writing is the rules as such that govern the use of each card that most people will read once, then know.
so you have a character card on the left side you have your attack die, and then your weapon cards. On the right side of the character sheet you have your defense die and then your armour , shield and helmet cards. If you are attacking you pick up the dice on the left, if you are defending you pick up the dice on the right.

Unfortunately ranged weapons appear the most complex because of the set way all my cards are done format wise.
The main bits are it adds +1 die, it cant be used by wizard, it cant shoot adjacent targets, it costs 450g and it has 7 range and requires bolts and reloading - alot of info to put on a card....hence the mess.

In the end I opted for putting everything on the cards because I didnt want to have to create a rule book to govern my stuff and in original hero quest style - what is written on cards supersede what is written in the rule book.

[clmckay]

Quite frankly, I really like your system. It makes perfect sense when you think about it. Personally, I'd like to see all your cards. I can see myself converting to yours or a similar system.

[Lemmeron]

thanks clmckay,

I am trying to carefully tread the ground between RPG and boardgame...

My system is still a board game where you just have to look at cards and symbols and roll dice but has much longer playability due to having stuff to spend gold on and growing in strength over 3+ questbooks
But for the RPG'ers there is the text and detail explaining it all - which is also there for those Evil Wizard and Hero players who are sticklers for rules and want everything accounted for.

I have also tried to set it up to allow other people to pick up my ruleset and create their own characters, weapons and spells etc while giving them guidlelines to keep it balanced.

It can be as easy as rolling a few coloured dice instead of only white ones or a really in depth choice for a character between optimising defense, offense of choosing a middle ground or going ranged.

I am still trying to figure out the best way of showing the whole shabang so I am sort of expanding on things in the relevant forums that address the issues people are having and how I have dealt with them in my system.

Dual wielding for example will likely end up being its own thread...but it is fairly simple due to the way I have split things so that:
base die + weapon = attack roll
and base die + armour + shield = defense roll

I have play tested about 20 quests with an 8 year old girl, an 11 year old girl and a wife who wouldnt know what RPG even means.
They have picked it up as easily as learning the original game.

Sorry to derail the thread I know it is about crossbows - there will also be multiple reload cards in my system so you can choose to use the table one I have shown, OR a simple one that will say "If no monsters are visible a Hero may reload their crossbow as their attack action if they have any crossbow bolts remaining"

[knightkrawler]

I rather like to set the weapon stat to a given amount of dices because if you make it a bonus, you needa rule more that tells you what you can combine and what not. Each rule less is a good rule.

Well, it's "Only one card denoting a weapon may be used at any given time." I fail to see the complication in that. It's in the chapter "Cards" in my rulebook.
Before that, the rulebook states that words in italics on cards are to be cross-referenced with the glossary.
It sounds complicated. It's not, once you've read the book.

[cynthialee]

My only real problem is shackling the Wizard with Black Dice for defense. As it stands he is already the weakest in Body and is an easy take down for some monsters as is. With only 1 chance on a D6 to roll a shield, the Wizard will die even faster than in the original version of HQ.
Now I do appreciate that he gets to roll the much more favorable Purple dice with equipment upgrades, but getting this hero to those upgrades will be far harder than I would be willing to deal with as a player*.
I would leave the Wizard as is, rolling white combat dice for defense, in the spirit of fair play.


*For the record I have never played as a hero, I have only ever been the EWP. Always the DM never the PC. *sigh*

[Lemmeron]

Hi Cynthialee.

All characters feel the pain being stuck with a single defense die at the start. I will also be writing some prequel quests designed to be played before the original quests sort of taking characters through their apprenticeships as such, culminating with being selected by the empire's archmage Mentor to undergo the Maze or if they excel and play as a group - the trial

I have always really enjoyed the early "levels" in any characters life where they have to think about what they are doing, rather than just walking into a room alone and swinging...

It is cool because even a group of goblins can become deadly real fast.

The wizard is meant to suck, especially at the beginning and starting with such terrible defense makes the step up to a magical cloak feel so much more powerful. The same goes for magical weapons and the accompanying upgrade in spells that goes with them.

Now wizards look forward to gear upgrades as much as the other characters !

Having Said this, the original hero quest gives characters OK starting equipment, so if you are feeling sorry for your players, you can give them similar gear to start with - but the early quests are pretty easy as it is (apart from the trial). The base gear is cheap anyway, so after a quest maybe 2 they will be rolling 2 dice

[cynthialee]

I just couldn't saddle any hero with a black dice to defend. That makes them as weak at defense as any of the low level monsters.
Other than the defense dice issue I have with your system, I love it. But that single dice and it being black dice for some heroes....Not worth it to watch my hero get gutted in a few rooms.

[Lemmeron]

Here are my ranged weapons, I have also posted almost all my equipment cards here -> http://forum.yeoldeinn.com/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=2962&start=50#p57101

[Gold Bearer]

I like it, except, why is the elf so good at defending? He should have the weakest defence and the dwarf the strongest.

And after a quick scan of your equipment I noticed that the great sword can be used by anyone other than a mage but the weaker bastard sword can only be used by warriors.

[Lemmeron]

Gold Bearer,

Elf is better at defending initially because for me they are light and agile, making them faster at dodging and evading attacks, but due to that they cant wear the heavy armour a dwarf can, thus a dwarf will have higher defense and offense once geared, but an elf is best with bows.

As above, the bastard sword is a 1 huge 1 handed weapon and thus cant be used by elves, but the 2 handed sword is a the only real 2 handed weapon an elf can use as the 2 handed axes etc are just too heavy for them.

It is part of making each class different and adding trade offs to each class and gear choices