4. HQ25 - Story Arc discussion

[sajungzak]

My ideas revolve around Kobold Dragonpriests and Dragonshields flooding the swamps and convincing the Fimir that the Great Wyrm is supposed to be awakened somewhere deeper in the bog where even the Fimir who worship dragons in general and the Great Wyrm in particular didn't think it is.

Of course, the two factions work together grudgingly to find the resting place, all under the eye of Morcar who wants the body of the Great Wyrm as a vassal all for himself (his essence), sending his chaos henchmen to steal the surprisingly young and little dragon thingie.

Morcar finds out it fell mystically asleep as a mere hatchling (or was "convinced" to do so) and abducts it into the chaos wastes for the beastmen and chaos dwarfs who have been called from their own industrious purposes in their own bloody brass city to watch over it and for their practitioners of magic and science to find ways to accomplish Morcar's plan.

If anyone cares.

I've been quiet for too long, but I'm paying attention, and I care. I like this. And can help, too.

[knightkrawler]

@gootchute and sajungzak:

Thanks, guys. Now, go and convince Sjeng and Goblin-King.
gootchute could do the bog/Fimir/Kobold/Dragon hatchling subplot. sajungzak, are you interested in that subplot (you two could share, I think 4 or 5 quests is enough to keep up tension for the players to then find out the whole storyline goes over to a different subplot) or in another or generally in all of the storyline?
Obviously changes are gonna have to be made to my overall dragon hatchling/Morcar host body storyline to accomodate others' plot ideas,
except IF that storyline only comes into players' minds during the last subplot.

If anything comes to fruition from my storyline idea, think of me as THE PRODUCER having suggested the idea to the director and screenwriter. My creativity stops there, except for clearcut questions on my opinion and stats and stuff like that. Creativity goes to the creative. I'm not good at writing quests, others are.

@all of you kind ladies and gentlemen:

However you wanna do it, if it's gonna be 25 quests, the thing NEEDS an overarching main storyline. It does not work any other way, not as a creative standard and neither as something that's supposed to hook players over AT LEAST five weekends! Remember that. It can't be hacked in pieces if it's supposed to be a quest PACK.
Also, when doing subplots, suppose you'll play anything between 2 and 4 quests an evening. So, a subplot, in my humble opinion, can have anything between 2 and 7 quests (My groups have never managed more than 3 average quests an evening; 4 from the game system, yes, but those are rather short).

[Goblin-King]

@all of you kind ladies

That would be you Sjeng thee hee

and gentlemen:

However you wanna do it, if it's gonna be 25 quests, the thing NEEDS an overarching main storyline. It does not work any other way, not as a creative standard and neither as something that's supposed to hook players over AT LEAST five weekends! Remember that. It can't be hacked in pieces if it's supposed to be a quest PACK.
Also, when doing subplots, suppose you'll play anything between 2 and 4 quests an evening. So, a subplot, in my humble opinion, can have anything between 2 and 7 quests (My groups have never managed more than 3 average quests an evening; 4 from the game system, yes, but those are rather short).

Look it this way. With "chapters" (that's the word I'm now using for the concept of individual quest arcs) it becomes more of an anthology of quests. This way you could play a complete chapter in an evening or two and get a conclusion.
You could even play a random chapter you just happen to find interesting without having to play through everything to get the complete story.
On the other hand if it's one big 25-quest story, there's a risk that the group goes dead before the end. Like if they need to take a break from HQ. It's horrible to continue in the middle of a story after a break!
tl;dr: chapters could easily work out.

Note: I do by no means hate the big 25-Q story. It's just way more difficult to handle.

KK: Your story isn't bad at all either! I can easily see it being condensed into a chapter. It would be great for the big end chapter.

KK, Sjeng and gootchute (can't you edit your post to make the story just plain text? pwease!)... You all have some good things going!
I believe you all have some visions for the story. Now I think it would help if you took the next step and went a little more specific with your story descriptions.
NOT "Then some orc stuff happens, followed by some chaos stuff"! Try and explain more detailed how the different segments actually fit together.
It doesn't need to be hyper detailed - leave some room for the quest writers. But as I see it, the story needs to be more coherent before we can get going.

[knightkrawler]

Now I think it would help if you took the next step and went a little more specific with your story descriptions.
NOT "Then some orc stuff happens, followed by some chaos stuff"! Try and explain more detailed how the different segments actually fit together.
It doesn't need to be hyper detailed - leave some room for the quest writers. But as I see it, the story needs to be more coherent before we can get going.

I want to encourage gootchute to do exactly that for the Kobold/Fimir arc, maybe a rough version leaning towards my vision and another whatever you envision, probably a little more along the lines how Goblin-King suggests to maintain chapters. That way, you would be much freer creatively.

Sajungzak, whatever you come up with in any respect, is well appreciated.

Goblin-King, have you ever read a novel cycle where each novel stands for itself, but slowly, over several or many novels, it's becoming clear that there's a deeper connection?
Harry Potter would be one example. The overarching storyline is Voldemort's coming back to life and trying to take over power. But every novel has its own storyline and plots.
The Star Wars film series ticks similarly. Hodlbein's Enwor Saga also springs to mind.
All these storylines come from background to foreground over time, at a point where you've probably digested some tension-intensive installments without noticing the progression.

A 25-quest quest pack needs an overarching story arc. It is perfectly fine if players only notice the connections and foreshadowings and suggestions of bigger themes and schemes in the last installment, which you call chapter.
That being said, it might be a good idea to let creators now write up stuff for subplots UNRELATEDLY and then, when everything nearly stands approved, put in the connections here and there. An artefact, something the EWP says during a quest, individual quest incentives, stuff like that.
After subplots stand, we can all discuss what and where to put those connecting ideas. Then we're both right, right?

[Sjeng]

Everything I'm reading here sounds great!
Let's just start writing, and see where it goes. Post it in this topic, and then see if we can tweak out stories so they follow up nicely. It's not very hard to change little things in a storyline so it all connects really. So don't hesitate, just write, and worry about connecting it all later.

KK: I don't think I ever needed convincing about your story

GK: start drawing some Bog spell card backs

TMU: where the hell are you man?

[Goblin-King]

Goblin-King, have you ever read a novel cycle where each novel stands for itself, but slowly, over several or many novels, it's becoming clear that there's a deeper connection?
Harry Potter would be one example. The overarching storyline is Voldemort's coming back to life and trying to take over power. But every novel has its own storyline and plots.
The Star Wars film series ticks similarly. Hodlbein's Enwor Saga also springs to mind.
All these storylines come from background to foreground over time, at a point where you've probably digested some tension-intensive installments without noticing the progression.

A 25-quest quest pack needs an overarching story arc. It is perfectly fine if players only notice the connections and foreshadowings and suggestions of bigger themes and schemes in the last installment, which you call chapter.
That being said, it might be a good idea to let creators now write up stuff for subplots UNRELATEDLY and then, when everything nearly stands approved, put in the connections here and there. An artefact, something the EWP says during a quest, individual quest incentives, stuff like that.
After subplots stand, we can all discuss what and where to put those connecting ideas. Then we're both right, right?

Your words are wise This shall be the way we do it.

GK: start drawing some Bog spell card backs

JEEZE! Allright mom! GAAAWD!

[MrBigB]

Man, I miss 1 day on here and have like 30 posts to catch up on. You guys work fast

MrBigB also wanted to do some quests. Let's keep this ball going!

I most definitely do! I should note though I have almost zero experience actually crafting quests, so I (and the project as a whole) may benefit huge amounts by pairing me up with a couple folks willing to teach me along the way. Given my lack of experience I'd be most comfortable trying my hand at something a little more basic like the opening few quests, stuff that falls closer to the basic HQ set.

All that said, I'm 110% in to help in any way I can (provided I can keep up!).

[Goblin-King]

Man, I miss 1 day on here and have like 30 posts to catch up on. You guys work fast

MrBigB also wanted to do some quests. Let's keep this ball going!

I most definitely do! I should note though I have almost zero experience actually crafting quests, so I (and the project as a whole) may benefit huge amounts by pairing me up with a couple folks willing to teach me along the way. Given my lack of experience I'd be most comfortable trying my hand at something a little more basic like the opening few quests, stuff that falls closer to the basic HQ set.

All that said, I'm 110% in to help in any way I can (provided I can keep up!).

We don't always work, but WHEN we do...

First step: I would suggest you start out by installing HeroScribe and make yourself familiar with it.
It's a simple program for making the actual map for the quests. It's the only way to do it!
http://www.heroscribe.org/download.html

[MrBigB]

Done! I got a hold of HeroScribe when this project got started and have got play with it some since. Thankfully it's very straight forward Is there a way to import custom icons? I assumed we'd do something along those lines for the added races/tiles?

[MrBigB]

Man, I miss 1 day on here and have like 30 posts to catch up on. You guys work fast

MrBigB also wanted to do some quests. Let's keep this ball going!

I most definitely do! I should note though I have almost zero experience actually crafting quests, so I (and the project as a whole) may benefit huge amounts by pairing me up with a couple folks willing to teach me along the way. Given my lack of experience I'd be most comfortable trying my hand at something a little more basic like the opening few quests, stuff that falls closer to the basic HQ set.

All that said, I'm 110% in to help in any way I can (provided I can keep up!).

We don't always work, but WHEN we do...

Couldn't resist...