HQ Common Notation System (CNS)

[Bareheaded Warrior]

Having been using hQuestBuilder recently I noticed that has a grid reference built in, that you can toggle on and off. This uses letters for the vertical axis and numbers for the horizontal i.e. the top row of the board is A and numbers start from 1 for the first column from the left of the board.

This got me thinking about all the various ways that I have seen the HQ squares defined over the years from grid reference systems to compass-based systems and the thought that a common standard may facilitate discussions.

Whist it is understandably to refer to this as a grid reference (after all we refer to the board as a Quest Map) but for me personally the representation is really of the board, a map of the board rather than of the territory so to speak, so perhaps a common notation system would work better if it was based on a gameboard rather than a map system.

This lead me to searching for other standard notation for board games based on a square grid which led inevitably to Chess, the king of all board games (or queen)

Algebraic Notation (Chess): Naming the Squares

Each square of the board is identified by a unique coordinate pair—a letter and a number—from White's point of view. The vertical columns of squares, called files, are labelled a through h from White's left (the queenside) to right (the kingside). The horizontal rows of squares, called ranks, are numbered 1 to 8 starting from White's side of the board. Thus each square has a unique identification of file letter followed by rank number. For example, the initial square of White's king is designated as "e1".

So extending this and converting for HeroQuest that would become

Common Notation System: Naming the Squares

Each square of the board is identified by a unique coordinate pair—a letter and a number—from the Evil Wizard Player's point of view. The vertical columns of squares, called files, are labelled "A" through "Z" from left to right. The horizontal rows of squares, called ranks, are numbered 1 to 19 starting from edge of the board closest to the Evil Wizard Player (orientated as usual by placing the HeroQuest logo facing the EWP. Thus each square has a unique identification of file letter followed by rank number. For example, the bottom left square of the board would be "A1", top right would be "Z19"

Any thoughts, either on the value of a common notation system, or on this particular system?

[Markus Darwath]

My only question is, "why?" It seems a workable system, but I'm not grasping the utility in being able to call out the map by grid reference.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

To facilitate our discussions

For example if you are discussing line of sight rules and examples (and when don't we) or giving feedback on a quest design, the only options currently are to have a long winded verbal attempt, "no, not that Orc, the one on the left", "the one by the Goblin?", "they are both by a Goblin, the one in the room next to the room with the Fimir", "which Fimir there are 2?" or for someone to go away and sketch it out, take a photo, upload it or dig out their board, set it up, take a photo and upload it, or fire up a tool like hQuestBuilder, design it, print preview, grab a screenshot, clip, save as image, upload and so on, all time consuming options.

In my opinion it will facilitate the conversation if you could just say the Orc in square A6, or you need to add a secret door, maybe in square B2, or I've moved the chest from C7 to D9

Or if I had an Elf in L19, an Orc in M19 and a Goblin in N17, then could the Elf shoot the Goblin?

[j_dean80]

I could see that being handy in certain circumstances, but it's not already printed on the board so would be hard to make an entire community adopt it.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

As there is no such notation of any kind on the board, that comment would apply to any such system, but I have no wish to force the entire community to adopt it, even if I had the power to do so. If you find it useful then adopt it, if you don't then don't.

[b_0]

It could also be useful for software development, or play by mail games. I don't see it as needed for enunciating particular strategies as is done in chess, because the board layout is too volatile with room existence and door positions changing from game to game. However I imagine it might be possible to use it for that purpose. I'd almost think it would be better if each room had it's own designation and tiles were addressed within the context of rooms (with hallways partitioned into sectors treated as rooms).

[Bareheaded Warrior]

I did try that approach of designating rooms and then squares within rooms but it broke down when overlays were used and was not intuitive for corridors.

[Kurgan]

When I first began streaming live HeroQuest games, I considered using a kind of grid system with letters/numbers, but it ended up being unnecessary.

We use a kind of orientation system based on the fact that I stream the games and my cameras are almost always oriented from Zargon's POV of the board (using the classic board's suggested position for where Zargon sits) use terms like "North/South/East/West" and "Left/Right/Up/Down." This only presents a problem if the players are using a different orientation to their display (such as with a smart phone) or of I'm using an odd camera angle (just switch to a more universally oriented camera at that moment).

Of course we also use it because as we're playing virtually/remotely with Zargon moving all of the pieces, he has to know the intention of the hero players for their respective pieces each turn. As HeroQuest's board layout changes based on the quest (and the quests are not limited to a canonical set), this has worked for us pretty consistently without extra complication.

[Daedalus]

The same held true in my experiences in the Play-by-Post Game Room. I can't recall if anyone used a gridded format there before . . . maybe?

[Bareheaded Warrior]

To be honest I wasn't considering the use of the CNS for Play-By-Post or Streaming Games as both of those use relative positioning i.e. you are indicating movement of a character in relation to their current position. I developed it for use in situations that use absolute positioning, such as the LOS example given above or because I spend a considerable amount of time giving people feedback on their own quest designs a situation like below.


I think you it would be better if you relocated the door in the room with the 2 mummies, to the room along the passage with the zombie in it

The room on the top left of the board with the 2 mummies?

Yes but you have 2 rooms in the top left of the board with 2 mummies, I meant the one that is slightly closer to the room marked "D"

Ah ok, but that room has 2 doors which one were you talking about moving and where to?

...

Much easier to state "Move the door from L19 to N17"