A traitor no more?

[Jabie]

So here's an oddity. In the original version of Return of the Witch Lord. The epilogue text read:

"Indeed, Loretome has shown me that Skulmar, who we believed to be slain, has escaped from the ruins of Kalos with many of the Witch Lord's most powerful spellbooks. He was aided by the traitorous Sir Ragnar who you once rescued from the forces of Chaos but who has now been corrupted by that same influence."

In the new version, the highlighted line has been removed. Which version do you intend to use in your campaigns, heroic Sir Ragnar or traitor Sir Ragnar?

[Bareheaded Warrior]

I suspect/hope, and this has been a long discussed and partially implemented plot twist here on the forums, that the line has been removed, not because he isn't a traitor but rather because they don't want to spoil the surprise at that point but leave it open for a future Quest or series of Quests. However that might just be me reading too much in to it combined with a little over-optimism.

[wallydubbs]

If I'm not mistaken, Sir Ragnar as a turncloak was only implemented in the European version. In the original North American version no such statement was made.

Although the remake does include Potions and equipment that was originally in the European version and lacking from North America, the overall remake leans toward the ladder with monster body points, quest names, etc. So it's not really surprising that this little tidbit of information wasn't included.

[Kurgan]

Return of the Witch Lord in Europe was released two years before ('89), so some consider that to be THE version. It's just such a curve ball thrown in like an afterthought and because I grew up with the NA edition ('91), I just ignore it since it was never mentioned there (much like I play the evil santa guy as Zargon since he's never identified as Mentor in the edition I played). But if you play the EU edition, he's a gosh darn traitor all right.

The remake follows the NA edition, but it's still your game, so you insert whatever lore you wish when you're running things, I say. Some want to make Sir Ragnar the bad guy in the Dark Company too. That's cool. In my head canon, well I'd be giving too much away if I said it here...

[wallydubbs]

I'd just remove the whole thing about Skullmar, he doesn't appear in any subsequent expansions and can therefore stay dead.

As for Ragnar, leave the memories alone. Keep him good. It might just be a personal preference as an American.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

I'd just remove the whole thing about Skullmar, he doesn't appear in any subsequent expansions and can therefore stay dead.

Yet, watch this space...

[Jabie]

Oh, as far as I'm concerned, Ragnar is a bad guy. And Skulmar... Let's just say I have plans for him too.

[HispaZargon]

Not sure if already discussed somewhere, but I have investigated a bit this point after talking about this topic with Amalgamash.

As far as I know at least these EU classic quest books of RotWL include the "traitor" sentence at the Epilogue:

- English UK
- Spanish
- German
- Dutch
- Swedish
- Italian (of course in this one the traitor was Sir Manfred instead of Sir Ragnar).

However French edition of RotWL omitted such sentence (Sir Ragnar is not mentioned anywhere), so for French players the knight was not a traitor...

Please, do you know if any other EU classic edition also avoided identifying Sir Ragnar as a traitor, like the French one?

[Kurgan]

Not Sir Manfred too?? I can't believe they got him... nooooooo


Anyway, I guess we'll have to see what Rise of the Dread Moon says. Will he be redeemed or consigned perhaps to a worse fate than before? I say if you're going to make him a traitor, give him a little more dramatic of a story than just the one liner oh by the way this happened...

Then again it's nearly endless... how about a quest pack to explain how Karlen/Wardoz got on the wrong path? Or Hinsgrim?