Disclaimer 1: I don't know where to put this, so I am going to stick this here and hope that it get's moved to wherever it needs to go if it's not appropriate here.
Disclaimer 2: I haven't done ANY work on any of this beyond vague thoughts, so this isn't even really a project, let alone a complete project.
Now that the disclaimers are out of the way, I would like to say that I think HQ, AHQ, and WHQ are some of the best games ever made. However, they all have their flaws, and I was thinking (and I can't be alone in thinking this), that TOGETHER these three games combined probably IS the greatest game ever created. Each has their strengths and weaknesses, and each brings key features to such a theoretical game - which I have dubbed RandoQuest (see what I did there?)
This thread is a general discussion of how the idea/project to create RandoQuest would work, but it's worth noting that the features here could easily be added to any of these games as desired, essentially improving every in different ways, because in general, incorporating the best bits of the others generally is the best way to improve these games.
The click-baity title is because of what I perceive to be the biggest flaw in HQ - issues regarding replayability and randomness. In it's own right, HQ is a great game, but once you have exhausted all the quest packs and so forth, unless you are in to designing your own quests, the game itself offers no real replayability.
Hasbro's reprint is going to highlight this quite clearly if it stays true to the original, which is only going to make any policy of "fire-and-forget" by Hasbro even more irksome. I don't see Hasbro supporting HQ, not only because they haven't done so until now, but the fundraiser and follow up support have been mixed at best, sending confusing, if not downright conflicting messages about what Hasbro is going to do.
I am going to lay down some ground rules that we will be working with going forth - first of which is that, like HQ, RandoQuest will not be explicitly set in the Warhammer World. This means some of the more Warhammer-centric aspects of the game will be optional. The main case for this is with magic, where all three games have wildly differing rules and thematic set ups, and I can get around to discussing which to use in a future post (if there's enough interest, maybe I'll get a sub-forum for this topic soon? I don't mind being a mod!)
Aside the lack of randomisation, and some issues regarding simplicity, HQ is actually the perfect game. It's a classic gateway game, but enjoyable in it's own right. As such, HQ makes for a solid base to work from, going forward. It's USP, of course, is the use of Combat Dice, which allows combat and similar results to be handled quickly and clearly. Someone around here said it best: "Use the special dice, people!"
Let's move on to AHQ. It is, as it says, more advanced than HQ, but the USP for AHQ is the random dungeon generator. In many ways, AHQ can be seen, with a few tweaks, as the best dungeon generation game out there. The only way to improve the dungeon generation of AHQ is to add more rooms, but in general, if you want a good dungeon generation system, some variant of AHQ is typically the way to go.
Finally, we have WHQ, which was a massive beast. It is, in fact, THREE different games, essentially being three different levels of play for the game. You had the Basic Game, which is a very solid Dungeon Crawler board game, using card-based Dungeon Design, and other Card-Based systems. WHQ also included the Advanced Game, and the Roleplaying Game. In fact, you could consider the Advanced Game TWO seperate games with similar themes - the first is In Between Adventures, and the second being Character Advancement. Both of these were either non-existant or limited in HQ and AHQ, and you can say that the Advanced Game was the USP for WHQ. You also had the Roleplay Game, which basically added a GM that both HQ and AHQ previously required, but was entirely optional in WHQ. WHQ's main flaw was that, as good as the Advanced Game was, integrating it with the Basic Game was somewhat problematic, as you went from Card-based to Table-Based random generation systems, even when such systems weren't really suitable.
So, ideally, as has been demonstrated by the many mods for HQ, an ideal solution - and thus the basic premise of Rando-Quest - is to create a HQ game with the random dungeon generation elements of AHQ, and the advancement options from WHQ integrated from the start. Also, we will be looking at using the best random generation system possible for each part of the game.
When it comes to random generation, there are two main types of systems: Card-Based, and Table-Based. Card-based systems use a deck of cards to choose or draw from, limiting you not only to the only results in the deck, but determining the odds based on how often that card is in the deck. Each card has exactly the same chance of being drawn, multiplied by how many cards of that type are in the deck. This system is best used if you are going to have a number of unique outcomes. For example, take the Treasure Deck from HQ - you have a number of Wandering Monsters and Hazard cards, but the Treasure Cards are generally unique, with different values for treasure found.
It should be noted that Token-Based systems are a devolved form of Card-Based random generation, and for all purposes, is lumped in with that. They tend to be less efficient that actual Card-Based systems and general, and are useful when the random-generation aspects of cards are more important than the other gameplay features of the cards. They are also useful if you wish to use them as measuring devices, markers, or counters. AHQ uses a random form of Token-based generation with the GM counters, and you can see a non-random version in the Power Tokens in AHQ. You can, in almost every instance, use Card-Based and Token-Based random generation interchangeably without affecting the gameplay mechanics itself.
Table-Based Random systems uses some form of random number generator, typically dice of some sort, to determine a result that is looked up on a Table. Although the RNG does the randomness, it's looking it up on the table which determines the actual outcome. Probabilities from RNG systems can create interesting complexities like bell curves that can be used to interesting effect. Likewise, RNG modifiers can also have an effect, which is why it's not until you look at the table, you get the outcome, as there's often little difference between a natural role of a 4, a natural roll of 3 with a +1 modifier, and a natural roll of 5 with a -1 modifier. The outcomes are limited to the possibilities on the table, determined by the Table and the RNG system. This system is best used if you have a few outcomes, and as each roll on the table is a unique event, repetitions of outcomes is not a problem, if not outright desirable. The AHQ dungeon generation rules are a superior demonstration of a Table-based system.
There are numerous ways to combine Card- and Table-based systems as well. You might have Cards with Tables on them changing the actual result of when a particular card is drawn, or they might just have an RNG element to change a variable. Alternatively, you might have a Table refer to a Card-draw, such as a table outcome saying that you should Draw 2 Treasure Cards. The key is to find the right combination of random generation systems for each game, being aware that you can combine them if desired.
If we look at each game, HQ primarily uses Card-based Random Generation only for its Treasure Deck, with the other cards and decks mostly being for reference purposes. This makes the Treasure Deck a defacto primitive Event deck, although the players choose when to search for treasure, and therefore control when these "events" occur. Commonly, cautious players will often decline to search for treasure. The rest of the game is largely prescripted, so HQ is more notable for its otherwise complete lack of randomness, which it comes to random generation.
AHQ uses Table-Generation for everything, from Dungeon Generation, to Monster Encounters, to Treasure. There are tables, and tables, and tables. It's pretty much a masterclass of Table-based Random Generation. However, it also highlights the issues with using tables - repetition. Multiple corridor sections in a row might be reasonable, but not so much repetitions of Chasm Hazards or Rope in Treasure Chests. Also, it wasn't until the expansion, Terror in the Dark, that a new set of Tables for Dungeon Generation were provided, which changed the odds of finding the Quest Room, demonstrating the biggest flaw with Table Generation - you may never actually get the result you are looking for in a specific set of checks, without dice roll or table modification.
WHQ uses Card-Based Generation for the Basic Game, and can be considered a master class in Card-based random games design. With card-based Dungeons, Encounters, Events, and Treasure, playing WHQ was a delight, as although the limited sized decks meant that the games themselves were different, with each card draw resulting in a more or less unique outcome, the limited size of the decks meant that the Dungeons were finite, and there was little repetition of vital treasures or encounters unless you exhausted the deck.
The Advanced Game switched from Card-Based design to Table-Based design, mostly because they didn't print out cards, and you could immediately see the difference. Whilst the tables, using the D66 method (Essentially a Percentile role, but using 2 d6, to generate a unique outcome of 36 different results - 1-6, 11-16, 21-26, 31-36, 41-46, 51-56, and 61-66) provided a lot of options, repetition of what were supposed to be unique outcomes was a problem. GW would eventually release a number of additional cards for their decks, covering MOST of the outcomes in the Roleplay Book. It also added a lot of NEW tables for additional randomness, such as events whilst travelling to town and resupplying between adventures.
Looking at these three games, we can see the following, when it comes to random generation. Firstly, random generation is KEY for replayability of any board game that doesn't have a lot of extremely enthusiastic support. However, too much reliance on randomness can make the game become very samey, so the presence of a GM or someone else to arbite and expand the game is desirable, even if not down right vital.
Secondly, systems with a lot of unique results (such as Treasures and Events) are best handled by cards, but systems where repetition is common (such as Dungeon generation) is best done by Tables. A system such as monster encounters can be either, depending upon whether you are looking for more uniqueness or more commonality.
Finally, you needn't limit yourself to a single random generation system. You can use Cards which have Tables (like a Trap with random outcomes), but you can also have Tables which draw Cards.
This last feature is important, because I am personally inclined to make the Table and Card approach the primary method of random generation in RandoQuest. That way, you still get the ability to have unique outcomes such as special rooms, special events, and special treasures, mixed in with otherwise seemingly mundane and similar table results. The primary means of doing this will be inclusion of a "Special" entry in relevant tables, which allows you to draw cards from a deck instead. This was how generating treasure in WHQ was handled in the Advanced Game, but unfortunately, the special treasures were repeated more than the use ones like Healing Potions.
There is the big question - is handing randomness to HQ still HQ? I would say that given the Treasure Deck is a form of Randomness (as is the few times you randomly Draw an Equipment Card), randomness doesn't actually CHANGE the gameplay of HeroQuest if handled properly. I believe randomness should be able to replace the EW if desired, but is more useful serving as a tool for the EW. One of the best parts of the WHQ Roleplay Game was how the GM could use the random features of WHQ during the game so that they didn't need to pre-generate everything beforehand.
If you look at the number of additional community mods that have been added to HQ which include random generation, I don't think the community has an issue with randomness in HQ. This approach has been taken with different decks, be it Potion Decks, Evil Wizard Cards, or whatever.
This is not the whole of RandoQuest, but I wanted to share my ideas, thoughts, and experience, to see what people think (and hopefully the Mods can decide where's appropriate for this thread), and I will continue this thread (or even post new ones if I get a sub-forum) on the other areas of the game... plus, now, maybe, I might get some damn sleep!
