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Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Discuss general topics relating to HeroQuest that don't fit well in the categories below.

Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby Tott » Monday January 14th, 2019 9:21am

is Ragnar (or a similar sounding word) offensive in italian?
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby clmckay » Monday January 14th, 2019 11:25am

I wondered that too. It seems like generally there's a historical or linguistic reason for changing the name. I would expect a change in Japanese for that reason but Italian surprised me a bit. Perhaps it just doesn't "flow" when interjected into a sentence or makes a sound not often heard in the language.


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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby knightkrawler » Monday January 14th, 2019 1:56pm

clmckay wrote:I wondered that too. It seems like generally there's a historical or linguistic reason for changing the name. I would expect a change in Japanese for that reason but Italian surprised me a bit. Perhaps it just doesn't "flow" when interjected into a sentence or makes a sound not often heard in the language.


I would bet my first ball it's about the Empire basically utilizing German names for locations and people and the translator's willingness to keep the connections to Warhammer. Italians tend to have more cultural clue than Brits and probably changed Ragnar (Nordic) to Manfred (outright German). We Germans did not do that. I'll bet my second ball on the reason being that we wanted to keep the background Fantasy, which is the reason why you can't just give the setting and people names from your own first language. It was still worth it because there was no other German sounding name transferred to HeroQuest from the Old World.
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby lestodante » Monday January 14th, 2019 2:24pm

The "GN" letters in the centre of Ragnar in Italian are prononced as you will pronunce in spanish Rañar, so it will not sound as a German name (I guess in german it should sounds something like RaKnar).
Also found in Greek it is Ράγχναϱ so it sounds more like Ragnar too (according to Google translator pronunce).

Maurice76 wrote:you could check the various quest books that can be found on the main site here, since they are available in like 11 different languages.


Not all languages are available unfortunately, many are missing resources. And in Greek I don't understand how to pronunce it.

Tott wrote:is Ragnar (or a similar sounding word) offensive in italian?

It doesn't sound even a strange name, maybe the only similarity is with the word RAGNO, wich means SPIDER.

Nicodemus wrote:Is there a PDF copy of the Italian Questbook floating around with the painting guide in it?


The painting guide I was referring to is just a small paragraph that you can see on the rear cover of the questbook in each languages, but in Italy they removed Mike McVey's reference.
It start directly with: "to paint miniatures:"
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby wallydubbs » Wednesday January 16th, 2019 9:40am

The Quest description of Quest 2 claims Ragnar is one of the Emperor's most powerful knights; most likely this is just an adjective to showcase the knight. We're not really given much to go on in regards to him.

It's my belief, however, that the name was adopted from the Legendary Norse Viking Hero, Ragnar Lodbrok, also known as Ragnar Shaggy Breeches. He features in many 9th Century Poems, featuring in raids over France and Britain. Much like Robin Hood, nobody knows for certain if this Ragnar Lodbrok ever really existed.

Manfred, also the name of a poem that comes out of England, is about a man tormented by supernatural entities. Had the poem originated in Italy I'd be more readily accepting as the reason for the change.

There were, however, 5 generations of Manfred's that ruled over the county of Saluzzo from 1125 - 1342. This was during a time when being an ordained Knight was a pretty big deal. That's the only important Manfred name I can find in regards to Italy... unless you count Fredrick II's illegitimate son, Manfred, who was named Vicar of Italy before being crowned King of Sicily.

On further note, I looked up the names of both Ragnar and Manfred in the Urban dictionary of names (not that it has any relevance) and found:
Ragnar- "freakin' awesome"
Manfred- "Man of peace"
Take from this what you will, but I'm pretty sure it's not important...
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby Thor-in » Thursday January 17th, 2019 11:40am

wallydubbs wrote:Take from this what you will, but I'm pretty sure it's not important...


Yet you researched it for awhile to get that much information on the subject.

I've done some research on Ragnar myself in the past and found some interesting stuff. But like you said, no one knows for certain.
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby wallydubbs » Thursday January 17th, 2019 12:15pm

Thor-in wrote:Yet you researched it for awhile to get that much information on the subject.

I've done some research on Ragnar myself in the past and found some interesting stuff. But like you said, no one knows for certain.


Well research is something I'm generally good at. But there's no positive nationalistic explanation; for all we know, the guy responsible for the translation from English to Italian had an uncle named Manfred who recently died, and he managed to slip in a little namesake momento into the game. I wouldn't be surprised by humanistic explanation...
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby lestodante » Thursday January 17th, 2019 2:16pm

Very interesting... maybe they really decided to use an epic name that could sound more common in Italy (but anyway he is Manfredi, with a final "i" and they changed in Manfred to make it not too obvious or too much italian).


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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby Thor-in » Thursday January 17th, 2019 4:26pm

wallydubbs wrote:
Well research is something I'm generally good at. But there's no positive nationalistic explanation; for all we know, the guy responsible for the translation from English to Italian had an uncle named Manfred who recently died, and he managed to slip in a little namesake momento into the game. I wouldn't be surprised by humanistic explanation...


I have always enjoyed the vast world of knowledge, the joy of learning something new. History was one class in school I never had a problem passing because I found it fascinating. To bad real life archaeology isn't anything like Indiana Jones.
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Re: Sir Ragnar or Sir Manfred?

Postby knightkrawler » Friday January 18th, 2019 3:55am

arcaeology isn't like science either, unfortunately....
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