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Crossbow Argument

Discuss Quests, Cards, Monsters etc, from HeroQuest Game Systems.

Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby drathe » Tuesday July 13th, 2010 12:27pm

I believe the basic problem with the Crossbow Argument are the facts. How far is it from one corner of the board to the other and how high is the ceiling?

Using the miniatures and furniture to judge the scale, each square is roughly 3 feet wide, making the distance from one corner to the other, 78 feet (26 yeards). Taking that and using the Gargoyle to measure the height of the ceiling (which we can't see), it's minimum of 9 feet high.

Now that we have the distance of 78 feet (26 yards) and the ceiling height of the corridor of 9 feet (I expect most rooms would have been carved with higher ceilings), we need to know how far a crossbow can shoot and the angle needed to make the range of 78 feet.

The average distance of a medieval crossbow is 300 yards, but distance and accuracy is two different things. Accurate shots are around 20-30 yards (40-50 for modern crossbows). Which is clearly within our needed range. Given the chance with dice rolls, this actually fits rather well. Now, what about the angle needed to achieve an accurate shot?

Now, I couldn't find any information on the angle or speed of an accurate medieval crossbow shot, but for an average modern crossbow, a bolt travels at 265 feet per second. That's just over 88 yards. Even if you half that, 44 yards (slightly less than generous given the ratio between the accuracy difference of modern and medieval crossbows), that's more than we need to make our accurate range. At 88 yards per second, we don't need to angle the crossbow much at all. I would say a crossbow in HQ should easily make the range of the HQ board given our height of 9 foot ceilings.

But each Morcar/Zargon to their own. The biggest problems with arguments such as these are where we draw the line between fantasy and reality, and complexity and simplicity. In real life, Orcs don't exist and people can't use magic. It's a fantasy world, designed to draw us away from reality. Enjoy it.
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby torilen » Tuesday July 13th, 2010 1:51pm

Amen drathe
That's what its all about - getting out of reality and having some fun.
For example - the actually role-playing games I've been planning as of late - only
20 or 30 people living in a town - allows the DM to keep up with those living there,
what they know, and the conversations the characters can have with them - is it
close to real-life....of course not...does it allow the players to enjoy the game more,
probably.


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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby runnar » Saturday January 11th, 2020 6:27pm

The crossbow is a ranged weapon, so I think is totally fair let the weapon be used to kill a monster at the other end of a corridor.
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby lestodante » Sunday January 12th, 2020 8:37am

another possible solution is: 10 squares is a good distance in my opinion. If you shot from a longer distance the arrow also lost his power, so the attack is reduced to 2 dice instead of 3.


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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby whitebeard » Sunday January 12th, 2020 10:59am

lestodante wrote:another possible solution is: 10 squares is a good distance in my opinion. If you shot from a longer distance the arrow also lost his power, so the attack is reduced to 2 dice instead of 3.



That's not really how it works, the drag on the bolt is minimal versus the short time of flight. The better argument would be 2 dice because of loss of accuracy.
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby wallydubbs » Monday January 13th, 2020 1:39pm

whitebeard wrote:
lestodante wrote:another possible solution is: 10 squares is a good distance in my opinion. If you shot from a longer distance the arrow also lost his power, so the attack is reduced to 2 dice instead of 3.



That's not really how it works, the drag on the bolt is minimal versus the short time of flight. The better argument would be 2 dice because of loss of accuracy.


Well if you want to start grading accuracy and distance on the shot you'd have to factor in the keen eyesight of an elf or night vision of a dwarf and experience of everyone else... but then it starts getting more like dungeons and Dragons and less like hero quest. It's supposed to be streamlined and simplified.

But Zargon does reserve the right to modify that in his/her respective game. But as long as the rules are concentric.
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby whitebeard » Wednesday January 15th, 2020 4:20pm

wallydubbs wrote:
whitebeard wrote:
lestodante wrote:another possible solution is: 10 squares is a good distance in my opinion. If you shot from a longer distance the arrow also lost his power, so the attack is reduced to 2 dice instead of 3.



That's not really how it works, the drag on the bolt is minimal versus the short time of flight. The better argument would be 2 dice because of loss of accuracy.


Well if you want to start grading accuracy and distance on the shot you'd have to factor in the keen eyesight of an elf or night vision of a dwarf and experience of everyone else... but then it starts getting more like dungeons and Dragons and less like hero quest. It's supposed to be streamlined and simplified.

But Zargon does reserve the right to modify that in his/her respective game. But as long as the rules are concentric.


I don't want to grade accuracy. Lestodante wants a rational for not killing all the cool monsters before they can do damage. Accuracy is a better rational for this. Where in the rules does it say dwarves see in the dark and that elves are more agile?
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby wallydubbs » Wednesday January 15th, 2020 4:32pm

The rules, of course, don't say that. (The HeroQuest novel does).
But nor do the rules give limit to the Crossbow's range (except for an adjacent monster).
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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby Uncle_Elvis » Wednesday January 15th, 2020 10:49pm

It says it can shoot from all the way across the board, then it can. I can also add crossbow toting goblins, skeletons, and orcs to my side. Same physical stats as the regular baddies, but now with range. Helps even it up some.


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Re: Crossbow Argument

Postby Jalapenotrellis » Wednesday January 15th, 2020 11:28pm

Been watching this convo and nothing to add since I play the rules as written with one exception: I let the pit traps drawn from the treasure deck stay on the board. However, what expansion is it where the game gets ranged attacking monsters?
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