Carrying and changing equipment during a quest

[HispaZargon]

Yes, I always thought the game was designed to consider this as you say.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

You select your weapon as an integral part of your attack action, that is you attack a specific character with a specific weapon which includes equipping yourself with that weapon. You cannot change weapons outside of that.

I'm in shock, it appears that we three have actually agreed on something, I'd better get it into my rulebook quick before we change our minds! (this will be problem #34)

Luckily we can still disagree around the crossbow on diagonals (although I think Kurgan agrees with me that should NOT be allowed) but as you say there is a separate thread on that (and I already disallow that in my rules #8 Crossbow targeting diagonals - RESOLVED)

Crossbow Argument

Still outstanding is the crossbow and shield question but again I think there is a separate thread or threads for that one too (and I have an existing problem open for that one already Problem #24: Can you use a shield with the Crossbow)

Crossbow--2 handed or can use a shield?

[Bareheaded Warrior]

For the sake of HeroQuest I would say a Spear or Staff or Battle Axe doesn't get combined with the Shield in sense that I'm not forcing the person to drop it (and pick it up the next turn) but I am saying if they for example said they were equipping it and attacked with it, then they can only switch at the beginning of their next turn. So if they get attacked in between they don't get to use the shield. If they defended with the shield they are holding the shield... but I guess that means I'm allowing them to then switch to the battle axe again (putting away the shield) and they can't defend with the shield this round. Each round they are deciding which one they have.

I'm far less strict with all other types of armor and weapons. So if they have a longsword and a shortsword I'm not bother to ask them except right before they roll. When the Ice Gremlin comes by to steal their weapon, it can't steal the weapon out of their hand or the shield from their grasp, so THEN it matters to know what they have claimed they are holding.

So I'd just be conscious of that.

The whole "switching mechanic" thing we only talk about because we know there are players who will try to "CHEAT" making the rule irrelevant by saying they are switching to shield every time they defend and switching to battle axe/staff every time they want to attack with those weapons, so we're trying to stop that.

I think just asking them to decide each round what they're holding before the action required is a simpler way in most circumstances than saying they have to use an action, or waste a turn, or are just forced to drop the object (and picking it back up again automatically makes them drop the other thing... but there you still are allowing them to switch on the fly so it doesn't really change anything, you're right there).

The reasons why I was raising concerns around "switching weapons" rules is that some form of restriction is implied in the game (even the First Edition didn't allow the combination of Battle axe and Shield) but there is no rule explicitly stated, so I was and possibly still am trying to define it.

Your comments above seem to imply that you use two switching weapons rules

1) You can switch weapons at the beginning of your turn

2) You can switch weapons as part of your attacking action

Surely one rule is simpler than two, as proposed above.

You select your weapon as an integral part of your attack action, that is you attack a specific character with a specific weapon which includes equipping yourself with that weapon. You cannot change weapons outside of that.

Also, as the game rules, as far as I am aware, don't have any restriction around Spear and Shield use I assume that we wouldn't be adding that?

The only reason I would forbid the BattleAxe or Staff + Shield combination is because the game rules say that, really no other reason.

For the sake of HeroQuest I would say a Spear or Staff or Battle Axe doesn't get combined with the Shield in sense that I'm not forcing the person to drop it (and pick it up the next turn) but I am saying if they for example said they were equipping it and attacked with it, then they can only switch at the beginning of their next turn. So if they get attacked in between they don't get to use the shield. If they defended with the shield they are holding the shield... but I guess that means I'm allowing them to then switch to the battle axe again (putting away the shield) and they can't defend with the shield this round. Each round they are deciding which one they have.

[Kurgan]

The Spear isn't part of the NA game, just like the Shortbow and Longbow many add, so it's a homebrew idea there, I admit.

[Bareheaded Warrior]

I meant that under SE rules there is no restriction around using the Spear and Shield combo

[Kurgan]

SE = Second Edition (1990 EU edition) ?

[Bareheaded Warrior]

From my signature

SE = European and Australasian Second Edition

So yes 1990

[Jalapenotrellis]

We have completed about 67 of the 69 quests (almost done), but we allowed weapon switch at the start of turn only. You had to defend on Zargon's turn what you attacked with. Passing items we follow the rules in the Barb and Elf quest pack (adjacent but not adjacent to a monster and on your turn). For armor switching e.g. Chain to plate mail, there had to be no monsters (basically out of combat only). We played crossbow can't use a shield to differentiate it from having a longsword used at all. Staff Def no shield. Some of yall are thinking too imaginatively and need to think about the action economy of the game and how the choice affects combat dice or the feel of the wizard as intended. We would allow "candyland" moving, that is moving without dice rolls, if no monsters were around and the area already explored with no risk of traps. This speeds up the game.

[HispaZargon]

I also play mostly as Jalapeñotrellis, those changes makes the game better. Just to point that i only allow changing the weapon at the beginning of the Hero turn (not a the beginning of the Heroes turn). I also think the Crossbow should no be combined with the Shield for the same reason (The Longsword gold price)

[Bareheaded Warrior]

I think we are all (or at least mostly) agreed that you should only be able to switch your weapon once on your turn and then you stick with that until your next turn (otherwise the restriction of battle axe and shield in the original rules doesn't make a lot of sense), the only piece that I disagree on here is the switching happening at the start of your turn as I'm not convinced that people who state that rule really play that rule exactly as stated (and for good reason) as in some scenarios it is unnecessarily restrictive.

A couple of examples:

(1) For example if you were the EWP and a hero player stated at the start of their turn, I'm going to move down the passageway towards the Goblin that I can see at the end and then shoot him with my crossbow. This means he has switched to the crossbow. He then rolls a 7 moves along the passageway, reaching a junction, revealing a new section resulting in an Orc placed next to him, would you rule that he couldn't attack that Orc as he has already "selected" the crossbow at the start of the turn. This seems unnecessarily restrictive, I would just say that he can select his weapon as part of the attack action, that way if the situation changes during movement, it doesn't matter.

(2)At the start of a hero turn, he could be adjacent to a closed door, would you really insist that he made his weapon selection at that point, and had to stick to it before he could open the door, revealing potentially monsters with missile weapons, or a single goblin or 4 ogres or a n enemy spell caster or whatever?

There are separate topics on "passing items" where the flaw in the rules presented in BQP/EQP are discussed under Potions: how do they work? and one for Crossbow--2 handed or can use a shield?

In terms of "candyland" moving, that is moving without dice rolls, if no monsters were around and the area already explored with no risk of traps. I understand on some of the Quests why you would allow that, but for me personally it isn't a problem with the rules it is an problem with the dungeon design on some of the dungeons (PM's gold for example) so I would fix that through modifying the dungeon design rather than the rules.