EU vs. JP rule comparison

Discuss the Rules of HeroQuest as set out by Milton Bradley Game Systems and Quest Packs.

EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby Bob-Bob » Thursday December 4th, 2014 4:01am

As a counterpart to my previous thread, I decided to do one for the Japanese rules. Since the resource translation forum is so far out of the way, I hope this thread helps most of you guys to understand the many many differences between the Japanese release and the other releases of this game. Please note that since the Japanese version is quite heavily based on the European version, I'll only be doing a comparison between the EU and JP release. Also note that the JP version never got any of the expansions, so there obviously won't be a comparison for those.

Backstory (Fixed thanks to Goblin-King)
EU: The game takes place in the same setting as Warhammer Fantasy. The players’ guide is named Mentor, the evil wizard is named Morcar, and the backstory describes Prince Rogar’s crusade against Morcar’s evil hordes.
JP: Takara seems to have crafted an entirely new setting for the game. The evil wizard player is called the “Demon King” and the wizard himself is named “Grimdead”. All of the location and character names are completely different. There is no Mentor or any similar guide character.

Rule Structure
EU: All of the game’s rules are in place from the start, although the first edition lets the players practice in Mentor's arena while the second edition proposes that the first quest be an “Introductory” game that only uses the Monster cards.
JP: The entire quest book is divided into three different “chapters”, each of which gradually add more rules:

Chapter 1 = Quests 1-3 = Beginner Rules
Chapter 2 = Quests 4-8 = Intermediate Rules
Chapter 3 = Quests 9-14 = Expert Rules.

In the “beginner” rules, only Monster cards are used.
In the “intermediate” rules, Treasure cards, Equipment cards, potions, searching, traps, hidden doors, and the new “level up” rule are added.
In the “expert” rules, Spell cards and optional rules are added.

Mind Points
EU: Mind Points are not used at all.
JP: Mind Points are not important at first, but are used in the later quests.

Expansions
EU: Future expansions are mentioned.
JP: Future expansions are not mentioned as Takara apparently never opted to publish any.

Quest Book
EU: The Quest Book is made up of “Quest Maps”, “Parchment Text” and “Quest Notes”
JP: Quest Map is called the “Dungeon Map”. Parchment Text is called the “Book of Adventure”. Quest Notes are called “Quest Rules”. Each quest now as an “End of Quest” section telling what happens after the quest is over and how it leads into the next quest.

Quest Treasure
EU: The five artifacts are called “Quest Treasure” and do not feature text on the back.
JP: Quest Treasures are called “Legendary Treasures” and are listed as such on the back. They are required for the heroes to complete the campaign.

Treasure Chests
EU: Treasure Chests are opened when searching for treasure.
JP: Treasure Chests work similarly to doors. A hero must move up to a chest and ask the evil wizard to open it. Unlike doors, the hero may not continue moving once the chest is open.

Monsters' Body Points
EU: All Monsters only have 1 BP, so 1 damage is enough to defeat them.
JP: The Chaos Warrior (called a “Dark Warrior” in this version) and the Gargoyle each have 2 BP. To defeat a monster with 2 BP, a hero must deal 2 damage in one attack. Any less and the monster’s BP will be restored on the next hero’s turn.

Rewards
EU: Heroes don’t receive anything for defeating monsters unless the quest says so.
JP: Each monster drops a certain amount of gold when defeated. The hero who defeated the monster receives the gold.

Dead Heroes
EU: If a hero dies, their belongings remain on the ground for the other heroes to pick up. If a fellow hero does not pick up the belongings, a monster may steal them.
JP: If a hero dies, their belongings are removed from the game. A player may revive their hero at the cost of all their gold, but only once.

Spells
EU: The Elf and the Wizard only have the four elemental spell groups and can use them from the beginning.
JP: The Elf and Wizard cannot use the four elemental spell groups until the “Expert” chapter. During the “Beginner” chapter, the Wizard can use a spell called “First Aid” as many times as he wants:

First Aid: May be cast on yourself or a fellow hero. Restores 1 BP.

During the “Intermediate” chapter, the Wizard can use two spells called “Heal” and “Holy Flame” as many times as he wants. The Elf may only use one of these at a time and must choose which one he wants to use before each quest:

Heal: May be cast on yourself or a fellow hero. Roll 4 combat dice and restore BP equal to the number of white shields.
Holy Flame: May be cast on a monster. Roll 2 combat dice and deal damage equal to the number of skulls. The monster must roll defense dice equal to their MP. The rules point out that undead monsters are especially vulnerable to Holy Flame since they don’t have any MP.

Choosing Spells
EU: At the start of a quest, the Wizard picks a spell group first, then the Elf picks a spell group, then the Wizard gets the last two spell groups.
JP: The Elf picks a spell group first, then the Wizard gets the other three spell groups.

Types of Traps
EU: There are four types of traps: Pit traps, falling rock traps, spear traps and treasure chest traps.
JP: Pit traps are called “Pitfalls”. Falling rocks are called “Crush”. There are no spear traps.

Jumping
EU: Heroes and monsters can jump over pits as long as they have enough moves left and an empty space after the pit.
JP: Rules are the same, except they also specify that you can only jump in a straight line.

Falling Rocks
EU: If a hero is hit by a falling rock, they roll 3 combat dice to determine the damage. The rules also state that a hero must “move to an adjacent unoccupied square” after getting hit by a falling rock.
JP: If a hero is hit by a falling rock, they take 2 damage. They must then go back one space in the direction they came from.

Disarming Traps
EU: Traps may be disarmed by the Dwarf or by a hero with a Tool Kit.
JP: Only the Dwarf may disarm traps. There are no Tool Kits.

Searching in Corridors
EU: Heroes are allowed to search for treasure in both rooms and corridors.
JP: Treasure cannot be found in corridors.

Potions
EU: Potions aren’t described in the rules at all.
JP: Potion cards obtained from a treasure search are kept in front of the hero. They are discarded after they’re used. They may only be used during the quest in which they’re found. After the quest is over, all treasure cards including potions are returned to the treasure deck. Furthermore, using potions is considered an action and they may only be used on a hero’s turn instead of moving. Heroes may not pass potions to one another during a quest.

Wandering Monsters
EU: If a Wandering Monster is found during a treasure search, a specific monster is placed on the board next to the hero based on the quest.
JP: Wandering Monsters are not quest-specific. Each of the five cards lists a different monster: Goblin, Orc, Skeleton, Zombie, Mummy. The monsters are not placed on the board either. They simply attack the hero once and then disappear.

Buying Equipment
EU: Heroes are allowed to purchase equipment right after the first quest is over.
JP: Equipment is not used until the “intermediate” chapter, so equipment is not available for purchase until Quest 3 has ended.

Shop Inventory
EU: When buying equipment, players are instructed to take the respective card and write the equipment down on their character sheet, but nothing is stated about what to do when the cards run out or if two players want to buy the same item.
JP: The rules state that there is a limited amount of equipment at the shop and recommends that the players talk it over when more than one player wants to buy the same item. There is enough equipment for each hero to attain their highest attack and defense values.

Selling Equipment
EU: Nothing is stated about selling or trading. Being able to sell equipment wasn’t introduced until the expansions.
JP: Heroes are allowed to sell equipment back to the shop at half price. They may also sell equipment to, trade equipment with, or give equipment to fellow heroes.

Thrown Weapons
EU: Nothing is stated about what to do with a weapon card after the weapon in question is thrown.
JP: The rules state that a thrown weapon’s card must be returned to the equipment pile.

Buying Potions
EU: Potions are not sold at the shop.
JP: Potions of Healing (called "Heal Potions" in this version) appear as Equipment cards and are sold at the shop. When a potion is used, it is returned to the equipment card pile.

Level Up
EU: Gold is only used for buying equipment.
JP: Gold can also be used for the new “Level Up” rule. Starting in the second chapter, heroes may pay 500 gold at the end of each quest for a chance to “level up”. The Barbarian and Dwarf then roll 4 combat dice. The Elf and Wizard roll 3 combat dice. If a hero rolls 2 white shields, he succeeds and his maximum BP will increase by 1. If he fails, nothing happens and his gold is not returned.

Projectile Obstacles
EU: The rules talk about line of sight, but do not say anything about what to do if another figure is standing in the way of your target if you’re firing a spell or a projectile.
JP: In the “expert” chapter, you cannot fire a spell or a projectile if another monster is standing in the way of your target. You can fire through fellow heroes just fine, however.

Searching When Monsters are Present
JP: Heroes cannot search if there are monsters in the room.
EU: Heroes are allowed to search for traps or treasure even if there are monsters present. In the “expert” chapter the “no search” rule is presented as an optional rule. There is also an optional rule where the players may not open treasure chests if there are monsters present.

Becoming a Champion
EU: If a hero completes three quests, they attain the title of “Champion”. In the first edition this is accompanied by a reward of 500 gold. In the second edition it's accompanied by absolutely nothing.
JP: The rules say nothing about becoming a champion.

Game piece differences
EU: The 5 artifact cards are called ‘Quest Treasure’ and are not marked as such on the back.
JP: The 5 artifact cards are called ‘Legendary Treasures’ and are marked as such. Borin’s Armor, Orc’s Bane and Spirit Blade have been removed. The Flame Axe, Freeze Bow and Silver Blade have been added. These three treasures are required to beat the campaign, as they are the keys to defeating the Evil God.

EU: There is a set of 14 Equipment cards illustrating what can be bought at the armory. They’re labeled WEAPON and ARMOR where appropriate.
JP: There are now 18 Equipment cards. The Bracers, Battle Axe and Tool Kit have been removed. A Helmet, two Shields and four Potions of Healing have been added. Prices have all been adjusted. There are also greater restrictions on which hero can use each piece of equipment.

EU: There is a total of 25 Treasure cards that can be drawn: 2 Gem! 6 Gold! 1 Jewels! 1 Treasure Hoard! 7 Potions, 3 Traps, 5 Wandering Monsters, and 1 Nothing!
JP: There are only 21 Treasure cards. 3 Gold!, 1 Gem!, and Nothing! have been removed. Treasure values have been adjusted.

EU: Monster cards have red backs.
JP: Monster cards have purple backs.

EU: Character boards feature blank backs.
JP: Character boards feature reminder text on the back for how leveling up works, how the Dwarf’s special ability works, and how the Elf and Wizard’s beginner and intermediate spells work.

EU: There’s a figure called the Chaos Warlock used for non-player characters and special monsters.
JP: The Chaos Warlock is called the “Evil God” figure.

Character sheet differences
EU: There is a space for a Name and a ‘Character’, which presumably means the class of hero you’re playing.
JP: There is a space for a Name and a ‘Type’ box where you circle which class you’re playing: Barbarian, Dwarf, Elf or Wizard.

EU: The character sheet only has boxes for Body and Mind points.
JP: They’ve added boxes for Max BP and Max MP, as well as Attack, Defense and Gold.

EU: There’s a ‘Tasks Completed’ box where you write down all the Quests your character has finished so far.
JP: There is a box listing the names of all 14 Quests, with checkboxes for you to check them off.

EU: The entire bottom half of the sheet is taken up by a coat of arms you can decorate yourself.
JP: The rest of the sheet is taken up by a box where you can write down Equipment you currently have.

Quest Treasure differences
EU: Talisman of Lore increases MP by 2.
JP: Talisman of Lore allows all four heroes to revive as many times as they want, still at the cost of all their gold.

EU: Wand of Recall allows the Elf and Wizard to cast two spells instead of one during their turn.
JP: Wand of Recall can only be used by the Wizard and allows him cast all of his spells as many times as he wants.

Equipment differences
EU: Broadsword costs 250 Gold. Sets Attack to 3. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf
JP: Broadsword costs 500 Gold. Sets Attack to 4. Used only by the Barbarian.

EU: Chain Mail costs 450 Gold. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Chain Mail costs 500 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf.

EU: There is armor for the Wizard called 'Cloak of Protection'.
JP: It's been renamed 'Mantle', a word commonly used for cloaks or capes in Japan.

EU: Crossbow is used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Crossbow is used only by the Elf.

EU: Hand Axe costs 150 Gold. Sets Attack to 2. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Hand Axe costs 250 Gold. Sets Attack to 3. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf.

EU: 'The Helmet' costs 120 Gold. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Helmet costs 250 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf. There are two of these.

EU: Plate Armor sets Defense to 4, but you can only roll 1 red die for movement. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Plate Armor sets Defense to 4 with no movement restrictions. Used by only by the Barbarian.

EU: 'The Shield' costs 100 Gold. Used by the Barbarian, Dwarf and Elf.
JP: Shield costs 150 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf. There are three of these.

EU: Shortsword costs 150 Gold. Sets Attack to 2.
JP: Shortsword costs 250 Gold. Sets Attack to 3.

Monster differences
EU: Chaos Warrior [ BP: 1 ]
JP: Dark Warrior [ BP: 2, Gold: 100 ]

EU: Fimir
JP: Monolizard [ Gold: 30 ]
The name was presumably changed since Fimirs are a creature from Warhammer Fantasy's mythos and the game no longer takes place in that setting in the Japanese release.

EU: Gargoyle [ BP: 1 ]
JP: Gargoyle [ BP: 2 ][ Gold: 150 ]

EU: Goblin
JP: Goblin [ Gold: 5 ]

EU: Mummy
JP: Mummy [ Gold: 50 ]

EU: Orc
JP: Orc [ Gold: 20 ]

EU: Skeleton
JP: Skeleton [ Gold: 10 ]

EU: Zombie
JP: Zombie [ Gold: 20 ]

Treasure differences
EU: Gold! can give out 1 red die x 10, 10, 20, 25 (two of these), or 50 gold.
JP: Gold! can give out 1 red die x 10, 25, or 35 gold.

EU: Jewels! gives out 50 gold.
JP: Jewels! gives out 80 gold.

EU: Potion of Healing recovers up to 4 BP.
JP: Renamed 'Heal Potion'. One of them recovers up to 3 BP. This could be a misprint.

EU: There's a potion called Heroic Brew.
JP: Its Japanese name literally means "Hero’s Drink" or "Hero’s Ale".

EU: Potion of Resilience may be used at any time.
JP: Potion of Resilience may be used only when defending. (I think. I might very well be wrong about this.)

EU: Potion of Speed may be used at any time.
JP: Renamed 'Speed Potion'. May be used only when moving. (Same here.)

EU: Potion of Strength may be used at any time.
JP: Renamed 'Power Potion'. May be used only when attacking. (Ditto.)

EU: Wandering Monster - The evil wizard places a monster on the board according to the Quest, which then attacks the hero who searched.
JP: Wandering Monster - Quests do not have specific Wandering Monsters. Each of the five cards lists a Goblin, an Orc, a Skeleton, a Zombie or a Mummy. They are not placed on the board. They simply launch a surprise attack, then disappear.

Spell differences
EU: Genie may either open any door on the board or attack any figure on the board with 5 combat dice.
JP: Genie may only attack any monster on the board with 3 combat dice.

EU: Swift Wind doubles a hero’s movement dice for one turn.
JP: Renamed 'Gust'. Teleports a hero to any space on the board, as long as it’s already been explored.

EU: Third Air spell is named Tempest.
JP: Renamed 'Storm'.

EU: Pass Through Rock allows a hero to move through walls for one turn.
JP: Pass Through Rock allows a hero to move through walls for one turn, but they may only move to areas that have already been explored.

EU: Ball of Flame deals 2 damage to any figure in sight. Target rolls 2 combat dice in defense.
JP: Renamed 'Fireball'. May be cast on any monster in sight. Attacks with 3 combat dice.

EU: Fire of Wrath deals 1 damage to any figure on the board. Target rolls 1 combat die in defense.
JP: Renamed 'Flame of Rage'. Deals 2 damage to any monster on the board. Target rolls 1 combat die in defense.

EU: Sleep may be cast on any figure in sight.
JP: Sleep may be cast on any monster in sight.

I think that's all. For a game built so heavily on the original release, there sure are a lot of differences, don't you think? :P
Last edited by Bob-Bob on Thursday December 4th, 2014 7:46am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby Goblin-King » Thursday December 4th, 2014 6:19am

The game takes place in the same setting as Warhammer 40,000.

In the grim darkness of the far future there is only war!

Surely you mean Warhammer Fantasy! :D


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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby Bob-Bob » Thursday December 4th, 2014 6:24am

Sorry, I'm not terribly familiar with Warhammer. I just know it's been mentioned on here that it has ties to HeroQuest. :oops:
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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby Goblin-King » Thursday December 4th, 2014 7:14am

Basically GamesWorkshop has two settings: Warhammer fantasy and Warhammer 40.000.

WHF is a made up world in a tolkin'ish setting. This is the same world as HeroQuest (Or at the very least highly similar).

WH40k, the sci-fi setting, is curiously enough NOT the fantasy setting, but in the future. It is it's own distinct setting and is actually OUR universe.
Earth is actually the center of mankinds empire! The two settings has some recycled stuff though. eg. several named demons appear in both.


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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby slev » Thursday December 11th, 2014 12:19pm

Goblin-King wrote:WHF is a made up world in a tolkin'ish setting. This is the same world as HeroQuest (Or at the very least highly similar).


The similarities to Tolkin are few. It's more a mash-up of Michael Moorcock, Pol Anderson and H.P. Lovecraft.

HQ is based on a VERY early outline of the world, hence being very similar in places, but radically different in detail.


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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby mitchiemasha » Thursday December 11th, 2014 2:55pm

Searching when monsters present, you've put the JP before EU.


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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby Daedalus » Tuesday December 16th, 2014 4:39pm

Bob-Bob wrote:As a counterpart to my previous thread, I decided to do one for the Japanese rules. Since the resource translation forum is so far out of the way, I hope this thread helps most of you guys to understand the many many differences between the Japanese release and the other releases of this game....

I loved your translation, so I'm diving head first and offering my thoughts on many of the changes:

Backstory
I like that the back-story is entirely separate. It implies a limit for the bad guys and offers a campaign alternative for folks at the Inn. My only problem is the feel of the Japanese names, which are lost in translation. The "cute" princess is particularly irksome. If I play the setting, she will change to "darling." I might rename Grimdead as well.

Mind Points
Implementation in the Japanese Quests is plus. The EU system botched this one.

Quest Book
The Japanese addition of an End of Quest section has a nice feel. This is a good alternative in place of EU Quest modularity.

Monster Body Points
The Dark Warrior and Gargoyle have their BPs restored on the Evil God's turn the same as the next Hero's turn, right? If not, this leaves the monster unable to move or act if damaged for just one BP.

Rewards
Adding up monster gold values wasn't fun in Warhammer Quest, so I don't think I'd like doing the same in Hero Quest. Gaining Hero-specific artifacts with buffs is easier and achieves the same end.

Spells
I find the Beginning, Intermediate, and Expert separation of spells awkward. Does a spell-casting Hero retain the casting abilities of previous levels? It isn't stated, but I think the game is probably broken if multiple castings of First Aid, Heal, and Holy Flame are retained with the addition of the elemental spell sets. I assume previous abilities must be swapped out.

Potions
I'm not a fan of the potion restrictions, in particular the prohibition of giving a potion to another Hero. I guess that is what all those multiple castings of First Aid and Heal are for. :smack:

Wandering Monsters (This section is listed again in the Treasure Cards section--I'd delete this earlier entry.)
I don't like the Japanese disappearing trick. A quick attack is better handled with Hazards, I think. Monsters should stay on the board. Perhaps this a gold-drop issue, but I'd just remove gold awards for Wandering Monsters.

Shop Inventory
The Adventure Design Kit corrected the EU problem of limited equipment cards with the new character sheet rules. "This also allows you to buy pieces of equipment for which there are no spare cards by simply paying the existing cost and noting them down."

Selling Equipment
Kudos to the JP rules for making this part of the base rule set.

Level Up
I don't like the randomness of the JP rule. This invites game imbalance. I think a better implementation would be a static cost of 750 gold for the Barbarian and Dwarf while the Elf and Wizard would pay 1000 gold.

Projectile Obstacles
Bob-Bob wrote:EU: The rules talk about line of sight, but do not say anything about what to do if another figure is standing in the way of your target if you're firing a spell or a projectile.

I think the EU rules do cover what to do if another figure is standing in the way. From the EU Rulebook, p.11: "Spells can be cast at monsters or characters provided they are visible to the spell-caster. Miniatures in the same room are always visible." Any figure standing in the way is irrelevant when both the caster and target are within the same room--the target is always visible for casting, so just cast. The same applies to shooting from p.15: "Your opponent must be visible, as with casting a spell."

For corridors or different rooms, "If the line passes through...another miniature then the target is not visible." Since the necessary condition for casting a spell cited in the paragraph above isn't met--visiblility--a spell cannot be cast at the blocked target, nor can it be shot at.

I don't think is was a good idea for the JP rules to allow targeting through friendly figures, as this encourages door-blocking.

Searching When Monsters are Present
While searching during a fight seems strange, this JP rule does provide for faster game play and opens up new possibilities. Is the Disarm a Trap action also included?

Quest Treasure differences
The JP Wand of Recall allows the Wizard unlimited use of his spells. This is an OP red flag to me.

Equipment differences
Bob-Bob wrote:...JP: Broadsword costs 500 Gold. Sets Attack to 4. Used only by the Barbarian....
...JP: Chain Mail costs 500 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf....
...JP: Crossbow is used only by the Elf....
...JP: Hand Axe costs 250 Gold. Sets Attack to 3. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf....
...JP: Helmet costs 250 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf. There are two of these....
...JP: Plate Armor sets Defense to 4 with no movement restrictions. Used by only by the Barbarian....
...JP: Shield costs 150 Gold. Used by the Barbarian and Dwarf. There are three of these....
...JP: Shortsword costs 250 Gold. Sets Attack to 3.

Bumping the weapons 1 AD feels munchkin to me, though this might be needed for the Dark Warriors and Gargoyle. I also don't like shoehorning the Heroes with weapon and armor restrictions.

Spell differences
Bob-Bob wrote:...JP: Genie may only attack any monster on the board with 3 combat dice....
...JP: [Swift Wind] Renamed 'Gust'. Teleports a hero to any space on the board, as long as it's already been explored....
...JP: [Tempest] Renamed 'Storm'....
...JP: Pass Through Rock allows a hero to move through walls for one turn, but they may only move to areas that have already been explored....
...JP: [Ball of Flame] Renamed 'Fireball'. May be cast on any monster in sight. Attacks with 3 combat dice....
...JP: [Fire of Wrath] Renamed 'Flame of Rage'. Deals 2 damage to any monster on the board. Target rolls 1 combat die in defense....
...JP: Sleep may be cast on any monster in sight....

I guess Genie was nerfed because of the unlimited Wand of Recall.
Gust is pretty cool.
Tempest plus JP Wand of Recall=neutralized Gargoyle. Over-powered.
Pass Through Rock is uninteresting in an exploring game, but I imagine the unlimited Wand of Recall necessitates this nerf.
Fireball is the same as Genie--this is uninteresting for a fire attack. I prefer the EU spell.
Flame of Rage auto-kills monsters with 1 Body Point. OP. I prefer the EU spell.

Bob-Bob wrote:I think that's all. For a game built so heavily on the original release, there sure are a lot of differences, don't you think? :P

Hell, yeah! While some of the ideas are very cool, most are there to emulate a computer-RPG. I don't think this makes for a better game in most instances.
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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby mitchiemasha » Tuesday December 16th, 2014 5:15pm

yeah, everything daedalus just said!!!


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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby The Admiral » Thursday April 9th, 2015 6:42am

Okay, so I have the translated rules and quests printed out along with notes on what cards there are. I have even printed out four Japanese charachter sheets and I am going to give this a whirl. My four, sort of themed, charachters are as follows:
Warrior :barbarian: = Musashi (using the samuri warrior figure from Darkworld Trilogy)
Elf :elf: = Miazuki (using Lidda figure from D&D the boardgame)
Dwarf :dwarf: = Kushami (using the Dwarf figure from the Darkworld Trilogy)
Magician :wizard: = Rikyu (using Myalae figure from D&D boardgame)

Some comments on some of the differences with the EU version basic set:
1) The EU version is much easier than the US version, and this seems even easier (but see point 5 below). Over the 14 quests there are even less monsters than the EU version. On average it is one less per quest. To mitigate this slightly, the Dark Warriors and Gargoyle have two body points which must both be taken out in one attack. Inflict just one and they get it straight back. The EU version tried to make things simple by not requiring the tracking of body point losses. This does the same thing but does at least give the most powerful monsters a little more staying power. I would have liked to have seen this extended to the Mummy and Fimir as well.

2) The first quest in the EU version was either the ridiculously easy "The Maze" or the most difficult quest of the game in "The Trial". The first quest here is slighly more difficult than "The Maze" with the heros facing eight monsters that are also a more interesting variety. The number of monsters per quest then varies between 9 (quest 2) and 20 (quest 14), with the bizarrely hard looking quest 7 having a whopping 29 monsters. This is not only nine higher than the next highest in quest 14, but also has the four heroes fighting seperately for the entire quest. The Warrior must fight his way through 10 monsters. This is more than the whole team meet in some quests! And there is no chance to escape the dungeon until each little solo quest is completed. Shades of "The Trial" again here.

3) The Spell cards work in pretty much the same way in both versions, but the basic and intermediary spells of the Japanese version are totally new, and also very ill conceived in my opinion. The Basic healing ability of the Magician seems very weak, until you realize that there is no time restriction in these games. In betwen bouts of fighting the team can just stand around until the magician has healed everyone back to their max BP's. The same goes for the Intermediate healing magic. i would have liked to have seen some limit on the amount of times these spells could be used, but then that would have required record keeping or extra cards.

4) The disarming of traps is not as much fun. There is none of the tension of the dice roll, as the dwarf, and him alone, can automatically disarm all traps.

5) The Treasure deck works in some way to balance the two games by making it harder. There is less treasure to find and thus more chance of drawing Traps and Wandering Monsters. Also the Wandering Monsters work in a totally different way. They are more like trap cards with no monster figure actually appearing on the board and with the monster attack being undefendable. This is a biggie, or would be without the endless healing. The heroes can stop in the first room and take as long as they can be bothered to keep trolling through the treasure deck. Traps and WM's are irrelevant, as the Wizard can just heal anyone back to max BP's while everyone else just skips their turn. It is utter nonsense.

6) The biggest difference in the two versions is "Revival". In the EU version the way to save a hero reduced to zero BP's was a healing potion. But in the Japanese version it is set out quite clearly that healing potions may only be taken instead of moving (bought potion) or action (found potion) and not at the instant of death. In the basic Japanese quests each hero is allowed one revival per quest. The hero is resurected to the BP's he/she possessed just before the act that caused their death and all their gold is lost; dedicated at a temple, presumably to the god who saved them and also presumably after the quest, although the gold is deducted immediately. There is obviously some sacred pact going on here where the saved hero, forever indebted to the power that saved him, has promised said power he will give his gold to the appropriate temple after the quest.

This gets even more bizzare from quest 4 onwards. The Heroes, as a group, now receive the Talisman of Lore. I have seen different translations of this card. In one it revives each hero once per quest. As this is already an ability the heroes posess in the first three quests, the Talisman would not imbue anything extra and there would therefore be no point in it's miracleous arrival. In another it revives the heroes numerous times. This seems ridiculous as the heroes can now never die, but is the one I believe to be true. In one translation there is some group revival which I don't really understand? If someone could give a definitive translation of this card it would be most welcome.

7) As a final point, which is not in way of comparison, I found the notes for the Japanese Demon King to be highly amusing:
"Don't concentrate attacks on one hero", and my favourite "Try your best not to kill the heroes".
Are you kidding! There are no 'Nicest Evil Wizard of the year' awards.
The Admiral

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Re: EU vs. JP rule comparison

Postby The Admiral » Friday April 10th, 2015 7:01am

The Japanese game as written is seriously broken. As it stands, in the very first room of the first eight quests they can obtain all the treasure and potions in the treasure deck. They can constantly cycle through the treasure deck knowing that if traps and WM's reduce BP's, everyone can take a time out while the Wizard heals them back to full strength. I have now played quests 1-5 and they are very easy, so I have played, and would recomend, allowing the Basic and Intermediate level spells to be cast once each. This will give the team a guaranteed 1BP in quests 1-3 and on average between 1 and 3 in quests 4-8 depending on whether the Elf selects the healing spell. This I think is quite enough for these quests and makes the treasure searching a much tougher option.

I'm having a great time though! Ghost ship next.

Spoiler alert.
[Reveal] Spoiler:
Don't go straight to the oracle after quest 4.
Last edited by Daedalus on Saturday May 30th, 2015 10:40am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: added spoiler tag
The Admiral

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Posts: 369
Joined: Wednesday April 8th, 2015 7:31am
Forum Language: British English
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