Quest treasure and Artifacts

[Idomeneas]

We all know that there are differences between the european and american rules. Although i ve known the game with the european rules, i always thoght that some things were too easy. I discovered that many of the american changes really makes sense. The extra monster hitpoints, the chaos spells (that one was the most basic thing), the number of monsters in quests etc. So i decided to convert my EU game to NA, along with some extra stuff i wanna make. In the main game its easy but doing the expansions the existence of extra artifacs comfused me. So i have some questions.

The Artifacts have different use than the Quest Treasures? The QT are special objects or magical weapons, found and used by all Heroes. The artifacts seems to be the same, with the difference that they include the Spell Scrolls. The SS ( ) can be used also by all heroes and here is my biggest objection/comfusion. Some of those spells are the same with the most powerfull spells of the game Wizzard and elf can use. This seems completely off balance cause if a great fighter as the Barbarian can cast a spell like Genie or Heal Body, he is the ultimate war machine. The whole point is that the players are forced to play as team completing each others skills, or else they are doomed. Do I get something wrong with those rules? Cause if im not Im going to incorporate the extra artifacts without the SS.

[Phoenix]

In the NA edition, they are called Artifacts, where as the EU edition calls them Quest Treasure. They are the same thing. They are doled out sporadically, as they should be. The Spells Scrolls fall under the Artifact classification, in the NA system. According to the Original Ruleset, any Hero may use the spell scrolls. The Spell Scrolls don't actually play a role until Kellar's Keep and Return of the Witch Lord. There are only a few times in those two quest packs when the Heroes will randomly draw one or two scrolls from the scroll deck.

As far as converting EU to NA rules (Quest Maps, etc.); I suggest going to my website (link in my signature) and checking them out, there. I have taken all of the Official Quests and Quest Packs and converted them into the NA ruleset (Falling Block Traps, color maps, etc).

As far as getting rid of the spells scrolls, I would just limit who can use them. Always remember, Zargon is the ultimate rule in HeroQuest and can make changes as he/she sees fit. If you read through my Imperial Academy Ruleset, you'll see how I've distributed the ability for using spell scrolls and other interesting bits.

[Idomeneas]

In the NA edition, they are called Artifacts, where as the EU edition calls them Quest Treasure. They are the same thing. They are doled out sporadically, as they should be. The Spells Scrolls fall under the Artifact classification, in the NA system. According to the Original Ruleset, any Hero may use the spell scrolls. The Spell Scrolls don't actually play a role until Kellar's Keep and Return of the Witch Lord. There are only a few times in those two quest packs when the Heroes will randomly draw one or two scrolls from the scroll deck.

As far as converting EU to NA rules (Quest Maps, etc.); I suggest going to my website (link in my signature) and checking them out, there. I have taken all of the Official Quests and Quest Packs and converted them into the NA ruleset (Falling Block Traps, color maps, etc).

As far as getting rid of the spells scrolls, I would just limit who can use them. Always remember, Zargon is the ultimate rule in HeroQuest and can make changes as he/she sees fit. If you read through my Imperial Academy Ruleset, you'll see how I've distributed the ability for using spell scrolls and other interesting bits.

I ll check that out.
About the spell scrolls i think that there should be different kind of spells that the main game. Also they should be either too specific to the quests in those expansions or of much less power than the wizzard or elve ones. by the way wizzard and elve still carry their spell sets right? So these would be double for some

[Phoenix]

Yes, the Elf gets three spells and the Wizard gets 9 spells. It is also true that the scrolls are the same as the spells, however, once a spell scroll is used it turns to dust and becomes useless. So, it really depends on how well the spell scrolls are used and how well the players plan to do things.

[drathe]

In all my games over the years, I've found the spell scrolls are usually given to the magic using characters anyway, as they are most familiar with them. On certain occasions, a Heal Body scroll or Courage may be kept by a Muggle character, so that they may use then if they happen into any dire situations and their companion's helping hands are far out of reach.

There are actually very few given out in these expansions. New spell scrolls are introduced in the Elf and Barbarian packs that are different from the spells the Wizard or Elf might have in their spell sets.

I too often thought it weird that these scrolls would allow a barbarian to cast magic, albeit temporary as they crumble to dust. I haven't had a real problem when a Barbarian actually uses a scroll, but I've often thought about adding a rule that Muggles may cast from spell scrolls at the cost of one Mind Point.

[Idomeneas]

Yes the Artifacts in the Barbarian and Elf expansios are more quest specific instead of generic. But personally i would prefer Artifacs to be usefull special objects, or at least minor magic spells, not heavy duty magic. Some potions, or tricks (not real magic) would be better. Generally things that work by themselves and do not require any magic skill, or complex mental state in order to do an invocation (hope im making sense).
Im thinking about replacing those spells with some of my own. If anyone have ant suggestions, they are welcome

[drathe]

So basically, anything that would take great understanding of arcane magic you would prefer be special spell sets for the Elf and Wizard. I totally agree. I've always wanted to make the scrolls Elf and Wizard only. Realistically, the Barbarian and Dwarf trained hard to earn the skills they have, as did the Wizard. The Elf... its instinct. So why should a Barbarian be able to use the same magic that a Wizard Trains for ages just because it's written on a scroll.

I see one solution. A great Wizard with vast knowledge did cast powerful spells and locked them in scrolls so that anyone who reads them would henceforth unleash the magic locked within. So basically, the Barbarian is only reading and some mysterious master Sorcerer (Mentor?) is actually casting the spell.

Suggestions: Have a non-magic character roll a combat die to see if they successfully cast the spell. With their limited knowledge there should be some sort of success roll. Something like, roll one Combat Die for each of your mind points. If a Black Shield is rolled, the spell is cast successfully.

[Phoenix]

What happens if the Barbarian (or Dwarf) fails? Do they just try again later OR does the spell scroll still turn to dust?

[Idomeneas]

So basically, anything that would take great understanding of arcane magic you would prefer be special spell sets for the Elf and Wizard. I totally agree. I've always wanted to make the scrolls Elf and Wizard only. Realistically, the Barbarian and Dwarf trained hard to earn the skills they have, as did the Wizard. The Elf... its instinct. So why should a Barbarian be able to use the same magic that a Wizard Trains for ages just because it's written on a scroll.

I see one solution. A great Wizard with vast knowledge did cast powerful spells and locked them in scrolls so that anyone who reads them would henceforth unleash the magic locked within. So basically, the Barbarian is only reading and some mysterious master Sorcerer (Mentor?) is actually casting the spell.

Suggestions: Have a non-magic character roll a combat die to see if they successfully cast the spell. With their limited knowledge there should be some sort of success roll. Something like, roll one Combat Die for each of your mind points. If a Black Shield is rolled, the spell is cast successfully.

Thats a great suggestion. It could work. Though i would still like to change the spells and make them totally original, not copies of previous spells. I would focus on minor spells that instill courage to heroes or fear to foes, give strength, disorient monsters, hypnotise, heal wounds etc.

[drathe]

What happens if the Barbarian (or Dwarf) fails? Do they just try again later OR does the spell scroll still turn to dust?

Since it's a house rule, you could choose either. They risk losing the spell, or it does nothing and they lose their action that turn.

Thats a great suggestion. It could work. Though i would still like to change the spells and make them totally original, not copies of previous spells. I would focus on minor spells that instill courage to heroes or fear to foes, give strength, disorient monsters, hypnotise, heal wounds etc.

I like the idea of instilling fear rather than a weaker version of courage. Seems like an ability the Barbarian and Dwarf would be able to have anyway. Like a battle cry or something. Something like Provoke, or Lure may be good too. What ever you come up with... we're anxiously awaiting the results!