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Additional barbarian skills?

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Additional barbarian skills?

Postby DullandRusty » Tuesday October 31st, 2017 1:00am

Hey all, loving the input from this site. I just found it a few weeks ago and it is really informative and communal! Anyway, question i have pertains to the barbarian. My playing group wants to spice up the heroes with skills they can advance to. The barbarian player proposed the following for the barbarian. A dual wield 2 handed weapons skill (which i Think with a few tweaks could be done without too much difficulty) a berzerker skill (when bp fall to x then gain 1 attk dice at cost of 1 def dice, lasting till healed or all monsters in room are dead), and a bloodlust skill (if failing to kill monster, may sacrafice half (or more possibly if half not deemed steep enough cost) of defense dice for a second attack. Repeatable till only 1 defense dice available. Defense dice stay limited till after all monsters in room are defeated, then will begin to regenerate 1 dice after every 4 turns till back to normal defense dice levels). Not sure on my thoughts on those last two. They definitely turn the barbarian into a damage machine and could add some interesting choices about when to use the skills as the penalty for the last one is pretty high (especially as a turn counter generates wandering monsters in our game to prevent heroes from sitting to regroup or in this case regenerate defense dice if we okd this skill. Most of these skills would come into play after the normal quests when advancing in harder homemade campaigns. Any thoughts?
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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby Gold Bearer » Tuesday October 31st, 2017 6:19am

I'd try to keep it simpler and stay away from fiddly rules like getting a dice back every four turns, that's a pain to keep track of. Here's a copy+paste from my quest pack if you want some more ideas.


Training
You can't do advanced training if you haven't completed standard training but you can do both at the same time.

Standard Training
Barbarian: Counts black shields as skulls in close combat and when throwing, can use a battleaxe with one hand and can wield a one handed weapon in each hand and attack with both if you don't move.

Dwarf: Counts black shields as white shields in defence, moves with the lowest two of three dice when wearing plate armour and is resistant to hostile magic.

Magic Resistance: When you're the target of an enemy spell roll a combat dice, skull = cast as normal, white shield = the spell has no effect on you, black shield = the spell is negated and discarded.

Elf: Three random elf spells (unknown to the EWP) in addition to the element groups, can cast from combined spell scrolls using the chaos scroll rule, moves with the highest two of three dice and fails a jump on a black shield instead of a skull. Movement and jumping improvements don't apply if you're wearing movement restricting armour other than elven armour.

Wizard: One Wizards Of Morcar spell group and either the Preservation or Divine spell group in addition to the element groups, has access to three of the initial six combined spells depending on your three element spell groups and can cast from elf spell scrolls using the chaos scroll rule.

Advanced Training
Barbarian: Counts black shields as three skulls in close combat and when throwing and can wield a one handed weapon in each hand and attack with both if you move no more than half rate.

Dwarf: Counts black shields as three white shields in defence, can use a battleaxe with one hand and can wield a one handed weapon in each hand and attack with both if you don't move.

Elf: All eight elf spells and one additional spell group (your choice) and no roll needed for casting from combined spell scrolls.

Wizard: Any four additional spell groups (but the Elf picks first), has access to all combined spells that you have the spells to create and no roll needed for casting from elf spell scrolls.


Additional Spell Groups
As well as the eight elf spells from Mage Of The Mirror there are five groups of three spells in addition to the element groups, three groups from Wizards Of Morcar, three spells from the Japanese version (Divine spells) and a group made up of the unique spell scrolls from the US expansions (Preservation spells). If the elf and wizard both have access to additional spells then the elf gets first pick.

Divine Spells
First Aid: Heals 1BP of the caster or a target in sight.
Heal: Heals up to 4BP of the caster or a target in sight. Roll four combat dice, heals 1BP for each white shield rolled.
Holy Flame: Two attack dice on a target in sight, target defends with the same number of dice as their current MP, fire based attack.

Preservation Spells
Ice Bridge: Can be used to create solid ground on one square such as a pit or chasm. Could also be used to trap a monster in a pit.
Recovery: Heals 3BP and all MP of the caster or a target in sight.
Treasure Without Doom: Can either be used to open a chest without risk or cast in combination with a treasure search, allowing the caster to ignore any harmful cards and draw a replacement.

Recovery is Psychic Recovery and Warmth from The Frozen Horror merged into one.
Last edited by Gold Bearer on Thursday November 2nd, 2017 6:07am, edited 1 time in total.
:goblin: 1BP, :orc: 2BP, :fimir: 3BP, :skeleton: 1BP, :zombie: 2BP, :mummy: 3BP, :chaoswarrior: 4BP, :gargoyle: 5BP. US :chaoswarrior: 3BP, US :gargoyle: 4BP.

Combined Spells: viewtopic.php?f=38&t=2454

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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby Thor-in » Tuesday October 31st, 2017 8:12am

Here is what GimmeYerGold has already made up, maybe it will help with your ideas.

viewtopic.php?f=34&t=1998
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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby cornixt » Tuesday October 31st, 2017 9:17am

Split attacks - can split combat dice between two monsters and attack each separately.
Barge - Give up combat dice to push the monster one square per skull rolled on those given up combat dice. May use remaining combat dice to attack as normal.


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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby mitchiemasha » Thursday November 2nd, 2017 12:09am

I prefer to attach skills to artifacts or the weapon itself. The short sword being dual wield by default, buy 2 get 2 attacks in 1 turn. No ones going to dual wield a broadsword. Berzerker is a character trait and Bloodlust is a potion.

Berzerker was created for the Half Orc who starts each quest with rock skin in effect. The Orc has a mind of 5 and when ever rolling movement, if a d6 is higher than Mind (so 6), the Orc goes Berzerk, attacking everything in the area. A very strong trait that can also be a serious threat to the heroes. If the EW weakens the Orcs mind he'll soon lose the ability to control his desire to kill Humans. As you can imaging, playing this character well, takes some skill.

I've linked the movement rolls to quite a few other bonuses in a very similar way.

Bloodlust: 500gc. Drink this potion to attack everyone/thing in the area you are in.

Nice and simple!!!


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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby kyrrahn » Thursday December 21st, 2017 2:10am

In the game I'm currently playing we gave the barbarian an epic fail attack where if an enemy that was engaging the barbarian failed to roll a single skull the barbarian could use his defence roll (2 dice default) to attack instead. Really helps him cut through goblins... found it helped without being broken.
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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby mitchiemasha » Thursday December 21st, 2017 2:45pm

Ahhh... A counter attack. However, giving this to the Barbarian, will make him even less likely to be attacked, when the EW finally gets a chance. In my experience a good EW will always try kill off the weaker characters first as it is, now even more so.

Counter Attack: Your defense roll becomes an attack if your attacker fails to roll a skull. Your opponent defends as normal.

We also have, Waaagh: Any skulls rolled in defence are hits against your attacker. Another kind of counter attack. Which fits the Orc perfectly, foregoing it's desire to defend taking the wounds, even death, to sink it's blade in your chest. Waaagh is active with all Orc when in the presence of a Chieftain.


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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby Daedalus » Wednesday February 21st, 2018 7:27pm

DullandRusty wrote:Hey all, loving the input from this site. I just found it a few weeks ago and it is really informative and communal! Anyway, question i have pertains to the barbarian. My playing group wants to spice up the heroes with skills they can advance to. The barbarian player proposed the following for the barbarian. A dual wield 2 handed weapons skill (which i Think with a few tweaks could be done without too much difficulty) a berzerker skill (when bp fall to x then gain 1 attk dice at cost of 1 def dice, lasting till healed or all monsters in room are dead), and a bloodlust skill (if failing to kill monster, may sacrafice half (or more possibly if half not deemed steep enough cost) of defense dice for a second attack. Repeatable till only 1 defense dice available. Defense dice stay limited till after all monsters in room are defeated, then will begin to regenerate 1 dice after every 4 turns till back to normal defense dice levels). Not sure on my thoughts on those last two. They definitely turn the barbarian into a damage machine and could add some interesting choices about when to use the skills as the penalty for the last one is pretty high (especially as a turn counter generates wandering monsters in our game to prevent heroes from sitting to regroup or in this case regenerate defense dice if we okd this skill. Most of these skills would come into play after the normal quests when advancing in harder homemade campaigns. Any thoughts?

You mentioned these skills would come into play after playing through the normal Quests. Did you mean all of the expansions? Have you tried any of these since the OP? In case you haven't yet started with your harder campaign, I thought I'd add my thoughts.

About dual-wield: A Hero will probably want to switch between this option and a single weapon such as a battle axe. Will you allow a full swap without restriction? I think it would be a good idea to only allow one weapon of a pair to be swapped in a turn. That way a cost is incurred by requiring at least one turn with a single, weaker weapon.

Paraphrasing mitchiemasha from your dual-wield thread, a 2/2 shortsword combo isn't that strong later in a campaign, though it functions well for standard Quests. A graded increase could help. I've decided upon basing the bump off of Body Points. At 8 BPs, a Barbarian can use a weapon pair that totals 4 AD, set at half of his BP score. After gaining the Amulet of the North and 2 BPs, the Barbarian can use a combo of 5 AD, such as a broadsword and shortsword.

Concerning the berserker skill, it only triggers "when BP falls to X." I think it also should state ". . . and/or below." This would allow the berserk to again trigger when BPs are reduced even lower. Perhaps defense should be lowered by two combat dice as a trade off for multiple use.

As for bloodlust, I agree with Gold Bearer that a four-turn recharge should be avoided. As dropping the timer strengthens the skill, you could counter by requiring all successful defense dice (white shields) to be rerolled for the remainder of the combat rather than halving. The repeatable part is also necessarily dropped, so it can only be used once per combat.
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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby DullandRusty » Thursday February 22nd, 2018 2:49am

Daedalus wrote:
DullandRusty wrote:Hey all, loving the input from this site. I just found it a few weeks ago and it is really informative and communal! Anyway, question i have pertains to the barbarian. My playing group wants to spice up the heroes with skills they can advance to. The barbarian player proposed the following for the barbarian. A dual wield 2 handed weapons skill (which i Think with a few tweaks could be done without too much difficulty) a berzerker skill (when bp fall to x then gain 1 attk dice at cost of 1 def dice, lasting till healed or all monsters in room are dead), and a bloodlust skill (if failing to kill monster, may sacrafice half (or more possibly if half not deemed steep enough cost) of defense dice for a second attack. Repeatable till only 1 defense dice available. Defense dice stay limited till after all monsters in room are defeated, then will begin to regenerate 1 dice after every 4 turns till back to normal defense dice levels). Not sure on my thoughts on those last two. They definitely turn the barbarian into a damage machine and could add some interesting choices about when to use the skills as the penalty for the last one is pretty high (especially as a turn counter generates wandering monsters in our game to prevent heroes from sitting to regroup or in this case regenerate defense dice if we okd this skill. Most of these skills would come into play after the normal quests when advancing in harder homemade campaigns. Any thoughts?

You mentioned these skills would come into play after playing through the normal Quests. Did you mean all of the expansions? Have you tried any of these since the OP? In case you haven't yet started with your harder campaign, I thought I'd add my thoughts.

About dual-wield: A Hero will probably want to switch between this option and a single weapon such as a battle axe. Will you allow a full swap without restriction? I think it would be a good idea to only allow one weapon of a pair to be swapped in a turn. That way a cost is incurred by requiring at least one turn with a single, weaker weapon.

Paraphrasing mitchiemasha from your dual-wield thread, a 2/2 shortsword combo isn't that strong later in a campaign, though it functions well for standard Quests. A graded increase could help. I've decided upon basing the bump off of Body Points. At 8 BPs, a Barbarian can use a weapon pair that totals 4 AD, set at half of his BP score. After gaining the Amulet of the North and 2 BPs, the Barbarian can use a combo of 5 AD, such as a broadsword and shortsword.

Concerning the berserker skill, it only triggers "when BP falls to X." I think it also should state ". . . and/or below." This would allow the berserk to again trigger when BPs are reduced even lower. Perhaps defense should be lowered by two combat dice as a trade off for multiple use.

As for bloodlust, I agree with Gold Bearer that a four-turn recharge should be avoided. As dropping the timer strengthens the skill, you could counter by requiring all successful defense dice (white shields) to be rerolled for the remainder of the combat rather than halving. The repeatable part is also necessarily dropped, so it can only be used once per combat.


we played all the expansions, so now are creating our own campaigns. These campaigns often have multiple "bosses" or situations where the heroes are in rooms with a significant number of monsters. we actually did just what you said on the berserker skill which the barbarian loves. we have also shifted the dwarf into a tank and he has a similar skill but with defense dice (when under x bp gain an extra def. dice) we have not tried the bloodlust skill yet but will likely add some form of it in at the next campaign (we are kind of limiting one new skill per campaign) the dual wielding 2 handed weapons such as dual wielding 2 Battle axes is not something I have added yet due to concerns it will get too high in damage dealing.
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Re: Additional barbarian skills?

Postby mitchiemasha » Thursday February 22nd, 2018 7:33pm

Daedalus wrote:Will you allow a full swap without restriction? I think it would be a good idea to only allow one weapon of a pair to be swapped in a turn. That way a cost is incurred by requiring at least one turn with a single, weaker weapon.

This is were sacrificing a move d6 comes in... Bonus Action: ReEquip!

Daedalus wrote:Paraphrasing mitchiemasha from your dual-wield thread, a 2/2 shortsword combo isn't that strong later in a campaign

Yes it's early game... Most start with a short sword and they're only cheap. It's the first bit of spice, variety one might try! A Hero that chooses to play that way will want to move onto something more powerful, once they have more money that is. You're not going to want a second sword when you can carry a spiked shield, lethal but rare.

Don't forget a Barbarian has his +1 in melee combat, for him that would be 3/3.

And, It always serves as a useful member of the team in heavily infest dungeons. Easier to plow through lots of weaker enemies. Strong attacks against a serious rat infestation are wasted.


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