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A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Discuss new Rules for HeroQuest.

Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby Count Mohawk » Saturday April 11th, 2015 9:39pm

I like the Wizard at 2 Attack / 4 Defend. Note, of course, that he can only reach this level in the base game with the Wizard's Cloak and the EU-only Bracers. Furthermore, the other Heroes can still reach higher levels of Defense, which means a 4D Wizard is still behind the curve on that front. 5 Defense requires one of the Shield or Plate Mail, and 6 Defense requires both, although one of the other Heroes can cheat with Borin's Armor.

I have seen many a player suggest the idea of rebuying Spells by rolling under their Mind Points. It's not a bad idea for increasing the Wizard's baseline, as he goes from 9 spells to an average of 12-13. (The Elf getting a chance at a freebie is good as well.) That said, it probably doesn't do enough to fix the Wizard's maximum level. For that, you need some other pieces of spell-related equipment for the Wizard to buy. I believe we calculated that such equipment should sum to about 2000 gold in another thread somewhere.


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Wednesday April 15th, 2015 5:10am

The Wizard equipment idea combines in the earlier "bonus abilities" I listed, and can work with or without the Cantrips.

I kept meaning to post the lastest revision, I thinks these work very well.

Rules option 1: A Wizard may take Cantrips as a Spell Group. Pick a number equal to the number of Spell Groups you select.
Rules Option 2: When a Wizard selects a Spell Group, he may also take the matching cantrip.

Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Fire Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you and make a Melee Attack using one Combat Die. Enemy may not defend. Return this card to hand at the end of your turn.

Word of Fury
By this Cantrip, the Wizard whips debris into the foe.
If this card is in your hand when you cast an Air Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may roll an extra red die for movement. This card returns to your hand if you roll any 6s for your movement.

Skin of Stone
By this Cantrip, the Wizard hardens skin against harm.
If this card is in your hand when you cast an Earth Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may add your Resilience Die twice when rolling for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose ant Body Points.

Esence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Water Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you and recover up to one lost Body Point. This card returns to your hand at the end of your turn.

Gaze of Dispair
By this Cantrip, the Wizard saps the spirit of the enemy.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Darkness Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you and make a one die ranged attack. The enemy defends with white dice equal to their current Mind. Return this card to your hand at the end of your turn.

Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Detection Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Protection Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one defence die each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose ant Body Points.

Force of Will
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores the will.
If this card is in your hand when you cast a Control Spell, you may discard this card instead of that Spell.
Use instead of casting a normal spell: Place this card in play in front of you and force one monster in Line of Sight to attack as if it where your Man-at-Arms. Return this card to your hand at the end of your turn.


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Tuesday November 17th, 2015 10:24am

Anderas worked with some of my numbers and ideas, and came up with a revised spell system (viewtopic.php?f=38&t=3217&p=62207#p62207). I took these ideas, and used them to refine my Cantrip system.


Cantrips (revised)

Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
Cast, Mastery 0: melee one blue, burning damage, target may not defend.

Word of Fury
By this Cantrip, the Wizard whips debris into the foe.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this vard in front of you. While this card is in play, you may add one red to your movement. If your movement roll includes any sixes, return this card to your hand.

Skin of Stone
By this Cantrip, the Wizard hardens skin against harm.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in front of you. While this card is in play, you receive Defence plus one black. Return this card to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Essence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 2: Place this card in front of you. The next time you would lose any BP, return this card to your hand instead.

Gaze of Dispair
By this Cantrip, the Wizard saps the spirit of the enemy.
Cast, Master 0: Ranged one blue. Target defends with White equal to Mind.

Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
Cast, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one skull each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Force of Will
By this Cantrip, the Wizard overcomes the will of the foe.
Cast, Mastery 1: Force one monster in Line of Sight to attack as if it where one of your Man-at-Arms.


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby Anderas » Saturday November 21st, 2015 1:53am

I wanted to read this post long since, i just needed to find the time

slev wrote:Cantrips (revised)

Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
Cast, Mastery 0: melee one blue, burning damage, target may not defend.

Nice one, not too strong... "melee" is the range?

Word of Fury
By this Cantrip, the Wizard whips debris into the foe.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this vard in front of you. While this card is in play, you may add one red to your movement. If your movement roll includes any sixes, return this card to your hand.

So it will work likely one or two times. Swift wind gets replaced by that... no stop. We added a "anywhere on the board" function to Swift Wind, so this might be a nice small alternative.

Skin of Stone
By this Cantrip, the Wizard hardens skin against harm.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in front of you. While this card is in play, you receive Defence plus one black. Return this card to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Yes I like. Currently i am thinking about selling your cantrips as potions. :)

Essence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 2: Place this card in front of you. The next time you would lose any BP, return this card to your hand instead.

Wow. This is a powerful protection. He can do that repeatedly? This i would definitely sell as potion! :)

Gaze of Dispair
By this Cantrip, the Wizard saps the spirit of the enemy.
Cast, Master 0: Ranged one blue. Target defends with White equal to Mind.

Anti Undead :)

Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
Cast, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one skull each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Force of Will
By this Cantrip, the Wizard overcomes the will of the foe.
Cast, Mastery 1: Force one monster in Line of Sight to attack as if it where one of your Man-at-Arms.

The last one is a bit strong. Imagine doing that with Balur.

All the rest, i really like them. They're not too strong: You have to spend valuable actions to use them, and with a proper EWP Deck, you just don't have enough actions to spend them freely.
I think i will really steal some of the effects as potions for my potion deck. :)


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Saturday November 21st, 2015 5:29am

OK, some god points there...

Burning Hand: Yes, "melee" is the range. It's an upgraded melee attack

Word of Fury could be a bit strong, and likley needs a new name. I'm considering replacing it with "return to hand to re-roll any number of your movement dice", which is still useful, but not as strong.

Essence of life could, indeed, be a bit strong. Perhaps changing the cost to 2BP or the effect to a re-roll any number of combat dice?

Force of Will: Could be powerful, true. Perhaps switching up the cost to, say 2MP and Mastery 2?


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Tuesday January 19th, 2016 9:54am

Updated once more based on the last feedback...


Cantrips (revised)

Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
Cast, Mastery 0: melee one blue, burning damage, target may not defend.

Breath of the Zephyr
By this Cantrip, the Wizard whips up a breeze to hasten their steps.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this vard in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one red every time you determine your movement. If your movement roll includes any sixes, return this card to your hand.

Skin of Stone
By this Cantrip, the Wizard hardens skin against harm.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in front of you. While this card is in play, you receive Defence plus one black. Return this card to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Essence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
Cast, 1BP, Mastery 2: Place this card in front of you. The next time you would lose any BP or MP, return this card to your hand and lose one fewer.

Gaze of Dispair
By this Cantrip, the Wizard saps the spirit of the enemy.
Cast, Master 0: Ranged one blue. Target defends with White equal to Mind.

Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
Cast, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one skull each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Force of Will
By this Cantrip, the Wizard overcomes the will of the foe.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery (Target's MP): Force one monster in Line of Sight to attack as if it where one of your Man-at-Arms.[/quote]


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby Count Mohawk » Tuesday January 19th, 2016 10:49am

slev wrote:Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
Cast, Mastery 0: melee one blue, burning damage, target may not defend.

Just to confirm, blue dice have a distribution of :skull: :skull: :skull: :whiteshield: :blackshield: :blackshield: , correct?
If you're curious about the math, this cantrip is better than a Shortsword vs monsters with 5 Defend or more, but pretty much always worse than a Broadsword, which is probably where you want the cantrip to lie on the damage spectrum.

slev wrote:Essence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
Cast, 1BP, Mastery 2: Place this card in front of you. The next time you would lose any BP or MP, return this card to your hand and lose one fewer.

You dun broke this one. Reducing damage by one is strong for a cantrip, but the Wizard has to spend the one BP he would save in order to power the spell, which means he's never better off by casting the spell than he is by tanking the hit.
Why not try wording it as "The next time you would lose any BP or MP, return this card to your hand and lose half as many, rounded down."? This keeps the core function of the card intact, adds a bonus case where the Wizard gains from having cast it (if he takes 3 or more damage at once) and can't be cheesed for infinite Body Points by standing around for a long time.

slev wrote:Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

You might think I'd have a problem with this one, since there's no net gain of actions by casting this spell, but you'd be wrong. The actual effect is to 'stock' an action for a future turn, which has a number of practical applications.

slev wrote:Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
Cast, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one skull each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

I'd like to point out that even at the Wizard's base Defend of 2 white, rolling at least one Skull is a 75% chance, which makes this spell only very slightly worse than Rock Skin. If you think that's too strong for a Cantrip, you might consider changing it to allowing the reroll of one Walrus instead. (Chance of Walrus with two dice is 31%, with three dice is 42% and with four dice is 52%.)


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Tuesday January 19th, 2016 11:09am

Nice numbers Mo!

I think I need to give Glittering Shield an additional 1MP cost in that case, as I speccifically don't allow enemy shields to be re-rolled by any of my cards or abilities.

As for Essence of Life, using the Broach of Mending, the Wizard can get back to 4BP, effectively having 5BP for a limited time.

That said, if it is underpowered, at "1" and overpowered at "all", then "half" or even "2" could be reasonable, or even changing the cost to 1MP instead.

Alternatively, it could be "return to hand to recover 1BP", which could save him from death when he hits zero.


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby Anderas » Tuesday January 19th, 2016 4:07pm

slev wrote:Nice numbers Mo!

I think I need to give Glittering Shield an additional 1MP cost in that case, as I speccifically don't allow enemy shields to be re-rolled by any of my cards or abilities.

As for Essence of Life, using the Broach of Mending, the Wizard can get back to 4BP, effectively having 5BP for a limited time.

That said, if it is underpowered, at "1" and overpowered at "all", then "half" or even "2" could be reasonable, or even changing the cost to 1MP instead.

Alternatively, it could be "return to hand to recover 1BP", which could save him from death when he hits zero.


I like Mo's solution for glittering shield and the action stockage as well.
Essence of life + Broach of mending + Broach of determination costs a total of 3 actions. I have rarely seen anybody having the free time for three actions. (ok, maybe except of "Prince Magnus' Gold").
Maybe if you add the wizard's staff on top, it somehow starts to look like something. Hm. Naah, i think i wouldn't include that one in my set. But the others, definitely, why not!


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Re: A Way to Fix the Wizard - Cantrips

Postby slev » Tuesday January 19th, 2016 5:08pm

Once more, with feeling:

Cantrips (revised)

Burning Hand
By this Cantrip, the Wizard pours flame into the enemy.
Cast, Mastery 0: melee one blue, burning damage, target may not defend.

Breath of the Zephyr
By this Cantrip, the Wizard whips up a breeze to hasten their steps.
Cast, Mastery 0: Place this vard in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one red every time you determine your movement. If your movement roll includes any sixes, return this card to your hand.

Skin of Stone
By this Cantrip, the Wizard hardens skin against harm.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in front of you. While this card is in play, you receive Defence plus one black. Return this card to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Essence of Life
By this Cantrip, the Wizard restores vitality to the injured.
Cast, 1BP, Mastery 2: Place this card in front of you. When an effect you would cause you to lose any BP or MP, you may return this card to your hand lose half as many (round down).

Gaze of Dispair
By this Cantrip, the Wizard saps the spirit of the enemy.
Cast, Master 0: Ranged one blue. Target defends with White equal to Mind.

Mystic Sight
By this Cantrip, the Wizard locates that which is hidden.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. You may return this card to your hand at any time. When you do so, you may take an additional Search (for Treasure, Traps or Secret Doors) that turn.

Glittering Shield
By this Cantrip, the Wizard enhances armour.
Cast, 2MP, Mastery 1: Place this card in play in front of you. While this card is in play, you may re-roll one skull each time you roll for defence. This card returns to your hand if you lose any Body Points.

Force of Will
By this Cantrip, the Wizard overcomes the will of the foe.
Cast, 1MP, Mastery (Target's MP): Force one monster in Line of Sight to attack as if it where one of your Man-at-Arms.


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