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Hero variations

Discuss the creation of new Heroes and share Heroes you've created.

Hero variations

Postby Templar » Wednesday November 9th, 2011 6:50pm

Hi!

This is my second small expansion of the basic game system. After making some spell schools of my own, I felt that some variation of the magic users, and the other characters would be nice...without having to make up new skills and special rules. Just simple, small variations to get another feel for the player.

I divided the original characters into four groups: warrior (barbarian), specialist (dwarf), enchanter (elf) and mage (wizard). Then I created a new character in each group. I want to know if the character names I have chosen are credable, and if their description is any good. (Edit: Enchanter used to be Semi-Mage)

Warrior
Knight Description - "You are the knight. You are an exellent warrior who fights your opponents with honour." (Edit: used to be"...according to an ancient honour code")
Attack 2
Defence 3
Mind 3
Body 7
Image

Specialist
Assassin Description - "You are the assassin. Your advanced training means that few enemies can withstand your attacks, and you can always disable any trap you find. You can disable all normal traps next to you."
Attack 3
Defence 1
Mind 4
Body 6
Image

Enchanter
Temple Guard Description - "You are the temple guard. Your armour and your magic skills gives you a defense without comparison. But remember that you are not trained in offensive combat." (Edit: character used to be Templar)
Attack 1
Defence 3
Mind 5
Body 5
Image

Mage
Druid Description - "You are the druid. Living a nomadic life in the wilderness has has taught you to fell prey quickly. But you can not handle longer battles without relying on your magic." (Edit: Changed after suggestion from Goblin-King)
Attack 2
Defence 1
You can use the same equipment as a wizard.
Mind 5
Body 5
Image

Any critisism is appriciated :)

(1st Edit: Changed some tings after recieved criticism)
(2nd Edit: Changed the description of the druid and added his equipment capabilities to his stats)
(3rd Edit: Added the character cards, in swedish)
Last edited by Templar on Monday January 30th, 2012 3:44pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: Hero variations

Postby Ethica » Thursday November 10th, 2011 5:46am

The balance is good. But I wouldn't choose to play a character that only had 1 defence dice.


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Goblin-King » Thursday November 10th, 2011 10:13am

I'll share my initial impression.
And as always: opinions are opinions.

Templar wrote:Warrior
Knight Description - "You are the knight. You are an exellent warrior who fights your opponents according to an ancient honour code."
Attack 2
Defence 3
Mind 3
Body 7

"according to an ancient honour code". I don't like this phrasing. It sounds too generic. The heroes are champions of the Empire. We know where they come from and what their story is. Make it "according to the honour code of the Empire or Sigmar or something like that. Or simply ...who fights your opponents with honour.

Also, is this honour code an actual rule or simply roleplay? :)

Templar wrote:Specialist
Assassin Description - "You are the assassin. Your advanced training means that few enemies can withstand your attacks, and you can allways (spelling) disable any trap you find. You can disable all normal traps next to you."
Attack 3
Defence 1
Mind 4
Body 6

This sounds pretty good. But 1 defence! :shock:

Templar wrote:Semi-mage
Templar Description - "You are the templar. Your armour and your (delete this) magic skills gives you a defense without comparison. But remember that your ceremonial staff is not fit for combat."
Attack 1
Defence 3
Mind 5
Body 5

Generally I'm not too fond of the word "Semi-mage". To me it sounds like "Mage, but worse". I don't have a better name though.
The description sounds good, but I'm a little bit confused about what kind of hero he is. I imagine a Templar like pretty much a paladin (A warrior with limited magic). Heavy armor and a ceremonial staff seems to clash a bit.

Is your ceremonial staff not fit for combat? Don't worry. That happens to all guys once in a while. :lol:

Templar wrote:Mage
Druid Description - "You are the druid. You are a wizard who has chosen to live a nomadic life in the wilderness. Hunting has taught you to fell prey quickly. But you can not handle longer battles. Rely on your magic."
Attack 2
Defence 1
Mind 5
Body 5

You are the druid. You are a wizard. Hunting has taught you... Too many labels!
Suggestion: You are the druid. Living a nomadic life in the wilderness has has taught you to fell prey quickly. But you can not handle longer battles without relying on your magic.

Again with the 1 defence! I hope he has awesome spells!


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Re: Hero variations

Postby torilen » Thursday November 10th, 2011 10:20am

If we were going to take a vote - I'd have to vote against the 1 defense, as well.
Look at the rest of the characters...with no armor, they all have 2 defense. That's
basically the defense of skin and minor combat ability...basically the ability to swing
a weapon at all.

If you wanted to give them a lesser defense, because their focus is SO FAR AWAY from
combat...you may want to tweak the original characters and give them +1 defense than
originally given. Then you'll need to give them +1 attack, as well, I think. Nothing wrong
with this really...they're heroes and adventurers...just add in a monster and a trap or two
into each quest...it'll all be good.


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Goblin-King » Thursday November 10th, 2011 10:32am

Or let them have 2 Def, but restrict what armor they can use. Only armor allowed by the wizard or even NO armor at all...!
But 1 is just too lousy for starters.
OR at least buff their body points!


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Ethica » Thursday November 10th, 2011 11:16am

torilen wrote:If we were going to take a vote - I'd have to vote against the 1 defense, as well.
Look at the rest of the characters...with no armor, they all have 2 defense. That's
basically the defense of skin and minor combat ability...basically the ability to swing
a weapon at all.

If you wanted to give them a lesser defense, because their focus is SO FAR AWAY from
combat...you may want to tweak the original characters and give them +1 defense than
originally given. Then you'll need to give them +1 attack, as well, I think. Nothing wrong
with this really...they're heroes and adventurers...just add in a monster and a trap or two
into each quest...it'll all be good.


I considered something like this a while back-

Double the number of combat dice used by all heroes and monsters for attack and defence. Then you can introduce more new monsters that have strengths inbetween the others.

However, I'm not sure how (statistically) this affects impact on body points, I think you might need to double them too, perhaps Daedalus could advise.

Anyway, that's slightly off topic.


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Templar » Thursday November 10th, 2011 1:59pm

Many comments in a short period of time, I like the way this forum rolls! 8-)

Let me just say that the AD/DD-values were the most obvious things to base a simple new character on. I basically just thook the non-existing combinations of combat dice, without the extremes of 1/1 and 3/3, and slapped on mind and body points in the middle of the spectrum (maximum 2 of each). I felt like this was an easy way to do it and keep the feel.

Thank you for your comments! :) I will try to explain myself as best I can...

Regarding the 1 defence value, I did'nt see this as a major problem myself, but since you all are very much against it, it appearently is.
I should tell you my own counters for this problem. Amongst my "easy" projects in this game I have made new equipment and spells as well, and my plan was to let them counter the weakness of 1 DD (amongst other things of course). One of the most crucial items is tha Leather Breastplate for 125 gold coins that gives the player 2 DD. It can be used by everyone, so the Druid can also get it. I hope the Assasin will have a high enough coolness-factor for people to take her at this point, but I'm also working on some very defensive spell schools to help Druid be a more valid option. (Nature spells ofc.)

And Goblin King, once again you have made a real effort to help out a fellow HQfan. :mrgreen:
-The bit with the honour code on the Knight is more or less stuffing in the text, so I dont have any problem changing it. Good call!
-Semi-mage is only a classification code to ease discussion. How about Enchanter? That could work...
-The word Templar really has no good translation to swedish (if you dont count Templar Knight, which I dont want to use). The wording I use in swedish is more like "Temple Guard". She is intended to be kind of a strange hero, who needs to rely on her magic untill she gets a better weapon. I think this is cool, but not everyone might agree. ;)
- The labelling of the druid being a wizard is, I think, necessary for me to keep the the feel and nomenclature of the rules. Most items can naot be used by a "wizard", which means that the druid has to be a kind of wizard. I can of course live without it. Do you think it is necessary to change the words on the weapon cards?

Again, thank you everyone for your opinions!
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Re: Hero variations

Postby Ethica » Thursday November 10th, 2011 2:44pm

I guess 1 DD isn't that bad I suppose. Once they start buying their equipment they all end up with similar rolls anyway.

Personally I wouldn't bother with the leather breastplate, because that makes the gap between your 1DD characters and the others only 125 gold. I'd let them sweat for longer.


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Goblin-King » Thursday November 10th, 2011 6:15pm

Templar wrote:Regarding the 1 defence value, I did'nt see this as a major problem myself, but since you all are very much against it, it appearently is.
I should tell you my own counters for this problem. Amongst my "easy" projects in this game I have made new equipment and spells as well, and my plan was to let them counter the weakness of 1 DD (amongst other things of course). One of the most crucial items is tha Leather Breastplate for 125 gold coins that gives the player 2 DD. It can be used by everyone, so the Druid can also get it. I hope the Assasin will have a high enough coolness-factor for people to take her at this point, but I'm also working on some very defensive spell schools to help Druid be a more valid option. (Nature spells ofc.)

If you are creating a whole new "package" with new characters, spells and items (and other new rules?) you should post these also. It's basically all a question about balance and all these factors are equally part of the equation.
Seeing all the new content together will make it easier to help balance it.
Does any of the characters have any "special" skills besides what you've already written?

Templar wrote:-Semi-mage is only a classification code to ease discussion. How about Enchanter? That could work...

I like! Go for it!

Templar wrote:-The word Templar really has no good translation to swedish (if you dont count Templar Knight, which I dont want to use). The wording I use in swedish is more like "Temple Guard". She is intended to be kind of a strange hero, who needs to rely on her magic untill she gets a better weapon. I think this is cool, but not everyone might agree. ;)

It's usually the other way around! You start with weapon skills and can later learn magic :lol:
Just out of curiosity... What is the Swedish word? :)

Templar wrote:- The labelling of the druid being a wizard is, I think, necessary for me to keep the the feel and nomenclature of the rules. Most items can naot be used by a "wizard", which means that the druid has to be a kind of wizard. I can of course live without it. Do you think it is necessary to change the words on the weapon cards?

The easy solution would be to add one simple sentence to the druid card: "You can use the same equipment as a wizard". No need to change all the cards.


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Re: Hero variations

Postby Templar » Friday November 11th, 2011 6:54am

Ethica wrote: Personally I wouldn't bother with the leather breastplate, because that makes the gap between your 1DD characters and the others only 125 gold. I'd let them sweat for longer.

That is true...but I'd still like to keep it, so that they can get access to it on harder quests. Perhaps a simple price increase to 250 gold? Lika a sword, not cheap, but not expensive either?

Goblin-King wrote:If you are creating a whole new "package" with new characters, spells and items (and other new rules?) you should post these also. It's basically all a question about balance and all these factors are equally part of the equation.
Seeing all the new content together will make it easier to help balance it. Does any of the characters have any "special" skills besides what you've already written?

I would very much like to combine my ideas in a single place on this forum, but I didn't find any suitable category for such a thread. Where would it fit?
And no, I have not given them any special skills (except the normal ones). I think it helps to keep the spartan feel of the game 8-)

Goblin-King wrote:Just out of curiosity... What is the Swedish word? :)

Well the most correct word I think would be "Tempelherre", which roughly translates to: Sir of the Tempel. This is from the name of the Knights Templar order in swedish, but this assumes the character is male, and the coolest miniature I found was female so it didn't fit. The other choice would be "Tempelriddare", or: Templar Knight...but I wanted my new warrior to be a knight, so that option was out to. Temple Guard seemed like a suitable compromise.

Goblin-King wrote:The easy solution would be to add one simple sentence to the druid card: "You can use the same equipment as a wizard". No need to change all the cards.

Very good idea! I can put it between the dice specifications and the stats on the character slate. I am on it!
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