5. HQ25 - Spells, tiles, mechanics and misc

[Gold Bearer]

I have no problem with you criticising any of my suggestions (although I do get the strong impression that your criticising them automatically because they're my suggestions). I have a problem with the way you're doing it and the tone of your posts, including your constant snotty attitude that definitely seems to be directed at me specifically for some reason. Look back at your posts over the last few days, I'm not being overly sensitive, you definitely have some personal issue with me. Deal with it. Criticise by all means, but do it without the attitude please.

It's not really a matter of what looks good but rather a matter of using artists' works without permission.
Hero Quest is an unsupported, dead game which is why I can accept that we recycle components from it. Logos, layouts, etc...
But using current, active artists' works is a whole other deal. Stealing art is not okay, even if it's non-profit.

This is my view on why I think we should use art made specifically for this pack. It is my personal opinion.
I was by no means trying to accuse you of stealing, simply stating that using other artists' art is the same as theft.
If you took this the wrong way I apologize.

Oh really?

Stealing art is not okay, even if it's non-profit.

Because it seems very much like that's exactly how you meant it. Please stop being one of these annoying people who constantly insinate stuff without explissively stating it so they can ruggle out of it by claiming that's not how they meant it. It's annoying and cowardly.

We post ideas, comment on them and modify them. If enough members agree on something, that's the way it's done.
You win some you loose some... And that is all okay.

Oh good, I'm glad you realise that. So now stop trying to make unilateral final decisions on everything.


Revised Spell Descriptions:

Cloud Of Flies
The room or corridor occupied by the caster fills with thousands of tiny biting flies until the beginning of the casters next turn causing the occupants to attack and defend with one less dice than normal. Doesn't affect undead or swamp/marsh/bog creatures.

Swamp Beast
The caster summons a swamp beast and places it on any square in sight. Use the gargoyle model if there's nothing else. The Swamp Beast acts as an ordinary monster under the control of the caster starting from this round and has the following stats: Attack: 4, Defence: 6, Movement: 4, Body: 4, Mind: 1.

Rot/Putrifaction
Causes a foul rotting of the flesh inflicting D3 (roll a standard dice and halve the number shown rounding up) skulls worth of possible damage on a directly adjacent target. The target defends with the same number of combat dice as their current mind points. Doesn't affect undead or swamp/marsh/bog creatures.

Insect Swarm
A swarm of flesh eating insects attack a target in sight with three combat dice. The target ignores any defence improvements for armour (a monster rolls one less defence dice than normal). Doesn't affect undead or swamp/marsh/bog creatures.

Disease
A target in sight is infected with a putrid disease and rolls a combat dice immediately and at the start of each of their turns. On a black shield the target suffers one body point of damage and on a white shield the spell wears off. Doesn't affect undead or swamp/marsh/bog creatures.


Edit: How about a marsh troll? I know we've already had the monster conversation but we didn't get that specific and trolls are part of chaos normally anyway, and a marsh troll fits in very nicely with the theme of that section. That's a swamp beast and a marsh troll as additional monsters if people are up for it.

[Sjeng]

Hmmm, let's try to view this as a friendly effort to make a nice quest pack with new spells guys. No need to get angry over it.

I do agree with GK mostly on the art. We should get our own artwork for new cards. Furthermore, I think we should keep the existing Fimir deck seperate from the new Swamp Spells. That way, we get 2 decks for future use
We could borrow one or two spells though, in the original HQ there are also some spells that are basically the same between expansions (if you have both EU and NA cards).

And about monster summoning spells: stay with the monsters we agreed upon if you want to plop down a mini. We have a list of monsters we all chose, so no sneaking in new monsters with a spell. An alternative is a tile, like the deadly mist (or whatever that was called) (which exists, so good to use!).

I like all the ideas being posted here! Keep it up

[Gold Bearer]

Hmmm, let's try to view this as a friendly effort to make a nice quest pack with new spells guys. No need to get angry over it.

I tried ignoring it but it got worse.

I do agree with GK mostly on the art. We should get our own artwork for new cards.

That's something I really can't help with. I struggle with stick men.

Furthermore, I think we should keep the existing Fimir deck seperate from the new Swamp Spells. That way, we get 2 decks for future use
We could borrow one or two spells though, in the original HQ there are also some spells that are basically the same between expansions (if you have both EU and NA cards).

Do you mean use both decks for this (one for fimirs and one for kobolds) and have a couple of spells that are in both, or just use the swamp deck?

And about monster summoning spells: stay with the monsters we agreed upon if you want to plop down a mini. We have a list of monsters we all chose, so no sneaking in new monsters with a spell. An alternative is a tile, like the deadly mist (or whatever that was called) (which exists, so good to use!).

You don't want the swamp beast and marsh troll? Fine, grumble, grumble. A summon toxic cloud spell? Interesting. There could also be a summon swamp zombies spell. Zombies with multiple BP. That's not exactly a new monster so surely that's okay?

I like all the ideas being posted here! Keep it up

I can't. I think I completely out of ideas now.

[knightkrawler]

I think we could make a deck of 6 spells (analogous to Wizards of Morcar) for the Fimir. They are thematically the Swamp spells because they live there. The name "Fimir spells" somehow doesn't sit with me well, cause the theme is lacking in name.
Remains a plethora of spell ideas that could make an additional 6 (or even 10 or 12) chaos spells to be assigned to (along with the game system ones) magicuser NPCs other than Fimir directly in the quests. Like the Kobold Whateverspellcasterwewriteupforthem.
That mixes it up a little.

So, most spells written up by now fit the Swamp/Fimir theme, and we should pick 6 of them, independent from Flint's existing spell deck. He would be very peeved if we used them for such a thing, anyway, I dare tell you all hereby. I translated them into English for him and he is really (rightfully) protective of his creations.
We should do all Fimir/Swamp spells alone, as everything for this quest pack should be new and not derived from something other people have done before for their own purposes. That's the same as with art. If we draw the line in front of borrowing established art, we must draw it in front of borrowing established card text and such.

[Gold Bearer]

Oh, I thought those fimir spells were Sjeng's!

I don't see why we shouldn't keep all the swamp type spells together in one deck and leave the chaos spells alone, it's neater. Otherwise we may as well put them all in the chaos deck. In Wizards Of Mocar those six spells are for a single character, we'll be using them for multiple ones, and at least two different types of magician.

[Sjeng]

I only pimped the fimir spells to look more like the original cards and added the new back.
Flint is mentioned in the credits.

But I also meant to keep the swamp spells and fimir spells seperated so we could use the new swamp spells for hq25.
Summoning bog zombies is perfectly fine! Special stats can be mentioned on the spell card.

[knightkrawler]

But I also meant to keep the swamp spells and fimir spells seperated so we could use the new swamp spells for hq25.

While that is a good prerogative, it just doesn't make sense.
The Fimir ARE the swamp magic-users, Fimir should get the swamp spells we whip up, there is no need whatsoever to come up with a Fimir spell set.
Fimir use Swamp spells, and if you want to give your Fimir hag for one quest more variation you include some chaos spells.
All other spells we come up with could be Chaos spells. Or maybe we make another type of spellcaster who also gets 6 spells of his own.

[Gold Bearer]

I don't think that's what he meant kk. I think means we should leave out all the fimir spells and just use the new swamp spells we create.

Summon Swamp Zombies
The caster summons the foul semi-preserved corpses of those who have fallen in the bogs of his homeland. Place three swamp zombies anywhere within sight of the caster. They act as ordinary monsters under the control of the caster starting from this turn. Swamp zombies have the same stats as ordinary zombies except that they each have 3BP.

Swamp zombies could be included as ordinary monsters as well. We're not using undead much.

How big is that toxic cloud tile?

[knightkrawler]

I don't think that's what he meant kk. I think means we should leave out all the fimir spells and just use the new swamp spells we create.

In that case, Sjeng and me... *dun, dun, DUUUN* ... are of one opinion.

Summon Swamp Zombies
The caster summons the foul semi-preserved corpses of those who have fallen in the bogs of his homeland. Place three swamp zombies anywhere within sight of the caster. They act as ordinary monsters under the control of the caster starting from this turn. Swamp zombies have the same stats as ordinary zombies except that they each have 3BP.

Swamp zombies could be included as ordinary monsters as well. We're not using undead much.

Great spell. I want that one! Also, I suggested Fir Bolg (I think I called them like that) as a third core monster type for the Fimir/Kobold arc. I also suggested them to be just regular Zombies, so I completely concur with you on the entirety of your post. I'm not sure if we should give them a different name than Zombie. It could spicen things up. How 'bout Swambies? Kidding. Bog Crawlers? Revenants? Fogwalkers?

[Gold Bearer]

I only pimped the fimir spells to look more like the original cards and added the new back.

I don't suppose you feel like pimping out my talisman spells?

In that case, Sjeng and me... *dun, dun, DUUUN* ... are of one opinion.

So am I now I know they're not Sjeng's spells.

I'm not sure if we should give them a different name than Zombie. It could spicen things up. How 'bout Swambies? Kidding. Bog Crawlers? Revenants? Fogwalkers?

If we do give them a different name they could still be referred to as swamp zombies in the spell description to make it clear what they are, and I like the sound of it. Not revenat though. The crow and scorpion from MK are revenants.

How about this?

Swamp Zombies
Movement: 4. Attack: 2. Defend: 3. Body Points: 3. Mind Points: 0.
Swamp zombies are putrid undead creatures that carry deadly diseases. Any non undead or swamp based character wounded by a swamp zombie rolls a combat dice for each (just roll once in the case of multiple wounds in one attack). On the roll of a skull they suffer an additional body point of damage. On the roll of a black shield they suffer an additional body point of damage and are infected with a cocktail of foul diseases and roll a combat dice at the start of each of their turns. On a black shield the target suffers one body point of damage and on a white shield the diseases are fought off. Any character kill by swamp disease becomes a swamp zombie and can't be resurrected by an elixir of life.

Another way to get diseased. I could add the turning into a swamp zombie clause to the disease spell.